F1 2021: Saudi Arabian GP - Jeddah (Dec 5)

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by F87source

How do you know Hamilton wasn't flat out pushing it to the max, but Lewis was just better at keeping it on line? Because he knows Max is behind him and he cannot afford to not get pole, so he has to make sure he gives it his all just in case. So there's no way Lewis would have let it slide during qualifying.

Then with a broken front endplate, Lewis was still able to pull away from Max. Without an end plate the high pressure air can spill over the edge of the wing to mix with the low pressure air creating a vortex. This creates alot of drag slowing the car down and causes it to lose alot of down force as well, and since it was on one side it causes handling imbalances. So that takes alot of skill to manage.


Do I think Lewis is better in terms of raw speed vs. max? No I think they are very evenly matched. The place where Lewis is better is in terms of racecraft, because he has the ability to understand when to back off and when to fight - lose the battle to win the war. Max doesn't have that yet, maybe he never will with his agression, but that is what makes Lewis faster overall... If Lewis can win this season it will show you how good he really is.

Advice : Don't try too hard to be such a HAM preacher

[MontyB1]

Originally Posted by kring

Official announcement- it was max’s fault for the crash

Max Verstappen has been handed a 10-second penalty for causing a Turn 27 collision with Lewis Hamilton in the Saudi Arabian Grand Prix, plus two penalty points.

The reason: "In deciding to penalise the driver of Car 33, the key point for the Stewards was that the driver of car 33 then braked suddenly (69 bar) and significantly, resulting in 2.4g deceleration”

So Max did break-check Ham.

So Max really was as dirty and classless in his driving as we all thought then, he really needs to have a bloody long hard look at himself.

[SteveChester]

Totally pointless penalty to dish out though!

[F87source]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Advice : Don't try too hard to be such a HAM preacher

Oh yeah for sure, because anyone who isn't pro max 110% of the time must be a ham preacher.

I'm not even focused on this season lol it's just for entertainment now, I'm thinking about 2022 and the new cars (what aero packages will look like, if wings will still be adjustable or if new wings are needed for different settings, what drs will looks like, how fast cars will be vs. this year, if the cars will be upset going over curbs and if down force will drop off suddenly and cause issues etc).

[ToddBlack88]

Stewards explain Verstappen decision
At turn 21 the driver of car 33 was given the instruction to give back a position to car 44 and was told by the team to do so “strategically”.
Car 33 slowed significantly at turn 26. However, it was obvious that neither driver wanted to take the lead prior to DRS detection line 3.
The driver of Car 33 stated that he was wondering why Car 44 had not overtaken and the driver of Car 44 stated that, not having been aware at that stage that Car 33 was giving the position back, was unaware of the reason Car 33 was slowing.
In deciding to penalise the driver of Car 33, the key point for the Stewards was that the driver of Car 33 then braked suddenly (69 bar) and significantly, resulting in 2.4g deceleration.
Whilst accepting that the driver of Car 44 could have overtaken Car 33 when that car first slowed, we understand why he (and the driver of Car 33) did not wish to be the first to cross the DRS.
However, the sudden braking by the driver of Car 33 was determined by the Stewards to be erratic and hence the predominant cause of the collision and hence the standard penalty of 10 seconds for this type of incident, is imposed.

[forza1976]

10 sec penalty. Still keeps 2nd. Eat it whiny ham

[MontyB1]

Originally Posted by SteveChester

Totally pointless penalty to dish out though!

Yeah it is but that’s probably all they could give maybe. Either way I think the team need to really look how they are handling him. He is being amped into these stupid desperate moves at every race now and they need to have some responsibility in that.

[F87source]

Originally Posted by ToddBlack88

Stewards explain Verstappen decision
At turn 21 the driver of car 33 was given the instruction to give back a position to car 44 and was told by the team to do so “strategically”.
Car 33 slowed significantly at turn 26. However, it was obvious that neither driver wanted to take the lead prior to DRS detection line 3.
The driver of Car 33 stated that he was wondering why Car 44 had not overtaken and the driver of Car 44 stated that, not having been aware at that stage that Car 33 was giving the position back, was unaware of the reason Car 33 was slowing.
In deciding to penalise the driver of Car 33, the key point for the Stewards was that the driver of Car 33 then braked suddenly (69 bar) and significantly, resulting in 2.4g deceleration.
Whilst accepting that the driver of Car 44 could have overtaken Car 33 when that car first slowed, we understand why he (and the driver of Car 33) did not wish to be the first to cross the DRS.
However, the sudden braking by the driver of Car 33 was determined by the Stewards to be erratic and hence the predominant cause of the collision and hence the standard penalty of 10 seconds for this type of incident, is imposed.

So max is the dirty driver then huh?

[SteveChester]

Anybody else think Masi isn't really up to the job?

Another mess really, confusion with Max/Ham and letting him past, offering up a grid swap to RB to see what they thought of it, Lewis double waved flags on the Sat that was an error etc

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by Poiseuille

hey Philippe, sorry your lad had a bad day, but regarding your BTW: I hate all street courses, including Monaco (which does however have good circus value). In some parts of this Country one can attend something called a Demolition Derby. I hate those also, and for pretty much the same reasons.
anyway, good luck next week.

It's OK . We'll see next weekend at Yas Marina .Thank you my friend

But : We need more power and pace ASAP !

[kring]

So how do the “2 points” come into play? Does Hamilton take the lead in standings now by 2 points?

[inTgr8r]

Originally Posted by forza1976

10 sec penalty. Still keeps 2nd. Eat it whiny ham

LOL, totally missing the point....

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by SteveChester

Anybody else think Masi isn't really up to the job?

Another mess really, confusion with Max/Ham and letting him past, offering up a grid swap to RB to see what they thought of it, Lewis double waved flags on the Sat that was an error etc

Masi is part of Mercedes .

[TheBingoBalls]

There are too many rules, a casual fan like myself won't know. I can read, interpret and understand the rules but at the time of watching, I would be confused.

The infraction was the braking and where the braking occurred. Guess it makes sense from a safety perspective, braking that hard in a straight zone probably isn't the smartest idea regardless of strategy.

[inTgr8r]

Originally Posted by kring

So how do the “2 points” come into play? Does Hamilton take the lead in standings now by 2 points?

No, the points are on his driver super licence.
I don't recall the limits, but if a driver exceeds the limits there is a race ban awarded.

[inTgr8r]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Masi is part of Mercedes .

typical response

[kring]

Originally Posted by inTgr8r

No, the points are on his driver super licence.
I don't recall the limits, but if a driver exceeds the limits there is a race ban awarded.

Thanks, so other than it being officially noted as Max’s fault and points on his record, there really was no actual penalty.

[Poiseuille]

Originally Posted by kring

Official announcement- it was max’s fault for the crash

Max Verstappen has been handed a 10-second penalty for causing a Turn 27 collision with Lewis Hamilton in the Saudi Arabian Grand Prix, plus two penalty points.

total of assessed points, current and expired:
Max Verstappen: 23 in 6 yrs
7ewis Hamilton: 10 in 14 yrs

[GuidoK]

Although this is by far the most chaotic race we've had this year (and there have been quite a few chaotic ones ), I expect next one to maybe be even more chaotic and filled with drama
And next year.... who knows
These are truely Senna-Prost times revived
(and yes, Senna also was a handful on the track, yet I never cheered for Prost; always Senna )

[F87source]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Masi is part of Mercedes .

Lol for sure... Or the reality of it is max is under so much pressure he's starting to be desperate and is doing a bunch of stupid things to try and win. Weaving to defend, brake checking, and cutting curbs like the rules doesn't apply to him.

[TheBingoBalls]

Next week, the name of the game is to get out in front ASAP.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by SteveChester

Totally pointless penalty to dish out though!

HAM got a "painless" 5 sec. penalty to push MAX with 51 G in the wall at Silverstone ..
MAX could have been killed in that crash ...