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07-10-2009, 03:49 AM | #1 |
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KKS Performance Exhaust (Review + Dyno numbers)
Update - Video
Enjoy - watch in high quality mode [u2b]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/bQQryFZ8sk8&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/bQQryFZ8sk8&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/u2b] Hi all, This is a continuation of my KKS Teaser thread (http://www.zpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=275767) I finally gotten down to my dyno again yesterday and again, here are the results of my pre-post dyno run. Post install videos will be taken and edited this week, but here is my 1st day impression of the exhaust install. ======================================== As posted @ http://www.zpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=275767 Quality and fitment KKS built a really good quality exhaust here. Welds were well done, no sloppy job. Fitment was perfect, no requirements for adjustment, direct bolt on, no hassles no fuss. Wiring harness and vacuum lines came with instructions to install, however this was the first time my exhaust shop in Singapore ever did such an install, hence i left it at their workshop for 3 full days with explicit instructions not to rush the job. Hose clamping, exhaust fitting and routing were pretty easy as quoted by the exhaust guys. Wiring was a bit more complicated but they managed to resolve it without any issues. Everything seems to be well-thought out. There was even an additional wiring harness which allows the valves to open automatically at speeds above 70KM. Didn't wire that up as I wanted to keep complete control of when and where i open the valves. (i stay in a condo and i come back from work late at night) Bravo to the KKS Performance guys for these options still. I had worries that the hose would melt under high heat, however they're of high temp properties which would withstand it. Time will tell i suppose, and i'll hoist up the car the next time i service it to check. Sound output Closed valve - Surprise surprise..and I'm speaking the very truth. It completely sounds exactly like stock, but only 5% bassier. It really is quiet, NO DRONE (this is the best feature), no burbling pops when the valves are closed. Revs also sound stock, there's no wild child when it's in closed mode. Video to come soon next week once I run more miles in it. (I have base line video recorded last weekend so i'll edit it for an easier direct video-to-video comparison). Had a good buddy sit in the car and he commented it sounded exactly stock - and he couldn't tell the difference. It is slightly bassier, but really, just very slightly. We could have normal conversations in the car, and we really had NO problems with the closed mode. Open Mode Now this is when everything starts to get a bit crazy. This exhaust is LOUD, snarly and extremely aggressive in open mode. Immediately you can tell when the valve is open, the entire area around your car is bathed in a lower, bass-ier hum. The sound is a sort of volumetric bass-iness, and not some crappy tone. In this mode, you will wake up your neighbours even by pulling in (okay if you don't rev hard - it will be still okay...but a tap will make this BARK). Went into an expressway tunnel and this thing just rips through the entire tunnel like some crazed bitch out of hell. It is loud, sharp, and gutteral raw. Now it's hard to describe sound in here...but i will do video (with good equipment) I don't have the internal drawings from KKS, however I am going to say this sounds exactly like a straight through muffler design in open mode. Again, until someone cuts this thing up, I cannot confirm it but hell it sure sounds like it. The most beautiful part of this exhaust.. After all the schoolboy fun, the snarly acceleration runs, the chills down your spine and adrenaline rush is over.. push a button and it's back to a stock gentle sounding car you always known. It's REALLY like a Dr Jekyll and Hyde experience. No kidding. At this juncture, I'm still running the exhaust on a 50/50 open/closed setting due to the city environments as well as residential areas i pass by in. Some initial first-thoughts are: 1. How the DME is going to adjust to this (do i leave it open all the way) 2. What about tuning? Do i tune this to open mode, or do i leave it alone. Performance wise At this point in time, I can't tell the difference through my butt and I dont trust my butt dyno. Haven't had the chance to push the car hard enough on any straights (so far just street driving) so i can't tell you the performance figures. Pedal feels lighter in open mode but it could just be my mind playing tricks on me. I will run the car next week on the dyno again and compare it to my stock dyno graph i took last week. Will share the performance throughput later. So far, i love this exhaust for the fact that it sounds completely stock in closed mode. Makes daily driving so much bearable. My eisenmann sports (on my previous 3.0 z4) sounded really great, but it made daily driving a little bit of a chore and on long drives the drone while cruising gets to you. I will update this post again once I have the videos (pre and post install) compiled and more details in. If anyone has any questions, feel free to pop them over. --------------- I'm not affiliated to KKS nor do I have vested interests in the company. Summary of 1st-day review: I'm pretty sold on this exhaust setup and I think it's pretty much the way to go for exhaust manufacturers moving forward. I wanted the capristo exhaust (original thread - http://www.zpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=253870) at first, but this has been a great and available option. It's suited for guys who want the best of both worlds. The KKS guys have been very responsive, great to work with and ship fast. My waiting time was about 5 weeks in total from order. I believe i waited about 2 months+ for my eisenmanns. Granted the price isn't cheap due to the mechanisms involved (additional grand above normal exhaust cans) but last night, i was driving with open mode and i spotted a cop cruising in front of me... switched it to closed and drove by him with no issues. Sweet. More feedback to come once I've run more miles in this and waiting to hit the dyno again. ======================================== STOCK DYNO POST DYNO (with stock in comparison) So as you all can tell, I've gained technically 1.7bhp from this modification. The close mode reduces HP and maxes at 350 wheel BHP and 287bhp engine. Just so everyone is clear.
Here are my personal review and observations... Is the KKS performance exhaust worth the money? Isn't it a glorified noisemaker for that kind of money? Am i even keeping it? If you ask me, yes. For a couple of reasons. a) It sounds REALLY great in open mode. No question about it. It sounds like an absolute race car. In tunnels, it will make the hair on your neck stand. You can really hear the S54 scream in a much aggressive mode. As i promised, quality video coming up soon. I'm getting my friend who's into video editing to get really good actual sound quality (no wind buffering etc that kind of thing) It is loud, grunty and will give this volumetric bass around your car. It sounds absolutely great when it starts up from cold. b) It goes back to stock sound when i close everything. Nothing vibrates, nothing rattles in the cabin. For Eisenmann owners, you know how the drone and vibration will literally shake every small plastic piece. I ran Eisenmann sports before and I had this issue. For long distances this was a PAIN to deal with, and my gf hates it. This time i have a very, very good option to turn it off and run in stock quiet mode. It's not cheap, but this time I don't have to deal with the overbearing noise when i go on my long runs. (I need to drive 330km just to get to my racetrack). c) Butt feel - Again, as i originally said, i do not trust my butt dyno. The sound in open mode absolutely disguises everything and makes things feel a lot faster, but as the dyno shows, there is little/marginal difference. I wanted to say my butt felt it's faster initially So If ANYONE ELSE tells you their butt dyno is accurate and a car runs alot faster due to an exhaust install etc etc, disregard it as BS first. A dyno run will tell the truth. Hey, you're paying money. You deserve to get what you paid for and expect. Some modifications actually compromise performance in return for sound, and that was my biggest initial worry. I have a close friend who has a M5, and lost 25bhp just from using a *cough* famous brand CF intake on his car. d) In this current state, the car is still UN-TUNED. As per the dyno graph, i can tweak my AFR to squeeze out a couple more horsepower, and the S54 engine, like most N/A engines are unable to squeeze out decent horsepower just from a muffler-only change. I've not touched the resonators/x-pipe which would give performance numbers if you wanted it (but realistically 10-15bhp with tune). At this stage, I am happy and satisfied with it as I know there is still quite a bit of potential (esp if i'm looking to go through the ESS SC route later - still considering it). e) The build quality is great. The tips are really nice looking and overall, I'm happy with the exhaust. I know this review is not complete without video or pics, but i thought i post up my numbers first so you guys have a good idea on what this is all about. Coming soon this weekend... So who is this exhaust suited for? People who want both stock-sound and loud options. A performance exhaust which offers options for boosted applications later. Someone who's considerate towards his neighbours Someone who does long drives and cruises (this will absolutely save you a headache) Someone who has picky wives and gfs. My plans in the near and far future are: 1. Drop in a K&N panel filter. 2. RPI Scoop (not sure as of yet) 3. ESS 525 Supercharger (much later on or never at all) 4. Resonator delete/ race cats 5. On dyno/road tune. Feel free to sling any questions over and i hope you will continue to enjoy my posts further on. Pics + Videos to come... For more information on this exhaust, visit http://www.kks-performance.com/ and look for Dominik!
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Last edited by ryanchua; 07-16-2009 at 02:42 AM.. |
07-10-2009, 11:54 PM | #3 |
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You can't have wheel bhp it I'd either wheel or bhp. Wheel horse power is less than crank horse power due to drive train loss, so you can't have more wheel than crank horse power. Anyway great right up and good luck getting your super charger, I hope I can get one some day then we can see some real gains.
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07-11-2009, 03:10 AM | #4 |
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@mendrax - In all honesty, don't expect to get a lot of power gains just from a muffler change WITHOUT tune. I also haven't touched anything from my mufflers upwards, hence the flow is not as optimized as someone who's worked in a larger midpipe, resonater delete and race cats. Hence, there is a still alot of restrictions up pipe. Please take all of these into consideration.
Alot of folks have lost power from cold air intake modifications, but they do it because of price and accessibility. I've been through that road before. Again, I'm happy to know that: 1. The KKS exhaust has better flow than stock and has a very slight hp increase just on the mufflers alone. 2. HP will definitely increase if i do the following exhaust mods to free up even more flow + road tune (as above). 3. I did this test (because im the first one to install it and dyno it with real numbers - to the best of my knowledge) 4. I still think the exhaust is a very worthwhile purchase (largely due to the option for sound/free flow capability) The guesswork is really to find out whether the flow is even more restrictive or free-flow especially when complicated valve systems are in place. And yes, you'll definitely love to hear the sound once i get the video up
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Last edited by ryanchua; 07-11-2009 at 03:38 AM.. |
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07-11-2009, 03:18 AM | #5 | |
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I have the drive train dyno for both runs and it was the exactly the same curve, hence i didn't post it up.
Yeah a SC really will make all the difference. Small mods give very marginal gains (i.e. intake, scoops etc) To see anything significant would really need a boosted application or turbo. I hate those 335i guys and their juiceboxes (haha j/k), but for N/A engines there's really a limit to how much we can do. This dyno goes to show that the M division at BMW has really maxed out the S54, and most of the time if i may dare say so, people put too much money into mods which has diminishing returns. (but hell we still do it anyway hahaha) We can put 5 grand into an evolution and have an additional 100hp easily. I'm still hoping one day HPF gets their hands to doing a kit for the Z4Ms. I'd be on that in an instant. Quote:
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07-11-2009, 09:16 AM | #6 |
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i highly doubt hpf will make a kit for our car because of the low number of owners. I bet if you go to their shop they would install it for you because our cars are so similar to the e46 m3. I would call them and ask if they can do an install.
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07-11-2009, 03:27 PM | #7 |
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I am sure I will appreciate the sound !
I know I will love to drive with opened exhaust but I'm a bit disappointed to see that when the exhaust is closed the car loses power. I am sure that the exhaust doesn't respect track regulation (noise) here in Switzerland and I need those 15 hp... Porsche Sport Exhausts aren't losing power when they are closed. |
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07-15-2009, 08:09 PM | #8 |
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Thread is updated with my video. Enjoy!
watch in high quality mode [u2b]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/bQQryFZ8sk8&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/bQQryFZ8sk8&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/u2b]
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07-16-2009, 12:28 AM | #9 |
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Wow, that sounds intense in open mode!
Congrats on your car and thanks for the detailed writeup. So would you consider this the same sound as a total muffler delete? I've heard a couple of the guys rev their engines without their mufflers (while they're messing around before they install their mufflers). If that's the case then this would probably take the cake for the loudest pure aftermarket cans one can get.
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07-16-2009, 02:17 AM | #10 | |
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Thanks! Glad you enjoyed the video and writeup.
I would assume that it's the same as a muffler delete. However I dont have any other samples in Singapore (less than 6 Z4Ms in total) to reference from. Again, this is just the muffler by itself. If i did the resonator/xpipe delete, this thing would be really really loud IMO. Prior to installation, when i looked through one end of the muffler, i could see through to the end (i.e. straight all the way) when the flap was open. Quote:
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08-30-2009, 02:10 PM | #11 |
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Just removed my resonators and replaced with a custom fab straight pipe.
Quiet mode sounds absolutely perfect (should have been a stock standard sound), and now i'm scared to get stopped by the cops in open mode. It is race mode blaringly loud. It'd make you go deaf for sure.
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09-03-2009, 04:52 AM | #13 |
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Quick update... am experience acceleration flatspotting between 2-3k rpm when stepping on the gas.
No resonators + straight through exhaust without tuning is not efficient. I still wonder whether tuning can help. Will update all again if i do tune my baby up.
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10-03-2009, 03:21 PM | #14 |
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i think your dyno is contrary to what has been posted about muffler deletes by laidback and RPI dynos...They found to lose some 20hp on top w/ no tuning...I'm wondering if it's b/c they didn't let the dme tune itself?? Did you drive in open mode for the 500km for the dyno?
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10-12-2009, 11:33 AM | #15 | |
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Update:
I fitted back my stock resonators. Found the low end slugginess too much for me to bear. Had been driving for over 3 weeks with the custom X-pipe and it SUCKED ASS. There seemed to be a perpetual flat spot of acceleration from 40-80 and if you're in the wrong gear, you would need to wait till your needle climbed to 5500 rpm and above before it would actually start pulling hard. Hated it. Took out all the fun in the car to be honest. Fitted back the stock resonators(x-pipe) and the car felt like i did a software upgrade instead. I didn't opt for the tuning as i was in half a mind to go for a supercharger upgrade. I'm going to keep my car as it is, just the KKS mufflers. It sounds all nice and good now. With the custom straight through X-pipe it sounded, like a really bad civic. For those who are running muffler deletes, if anyone has dyno numbers (or links) to them, feel free to post them here and specify your software. Quote:
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Last edited by ryanchua; 10-12-2009 at 08:52 PM.. Reason: edited for spelling and clarification. |
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10-12-2009, 08:20 PM | #16 |
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are you talking about the xpipe or section 2?
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10-12-2009, 08:51 PM | #17 |
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10-12-2009, 09:46 PM | #18 | |
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Quote:
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10-13-2009, 04:08 PM | #19 |
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strange that supersprint reports 7 hp increase form the xpipe. I havent had the same experience with my own xpipe although there is def some drone around 2k rpm.
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09-15-2010, 03:06 AM | #20 |
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Hey ryanchua. I joined ZPOST so I could contact you (usually hang at Bimmerfest) but I can't PM yet.
I ordered the KKS cans yesterday after viewing your video last week, before I realised you were on ZPOST. From reading your write up, I know I made the right decision. Your list of reasons why someone might choose the KKS option described me exactly. I want the option of sensory overload (especially on the track), with the ability to dial it down around town. Very excited!! Can't wait!! I have the ESS VT1 supercharger (just got installed on Monday. Love it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) so maybe you will want to see some vids of my car once it has been both KKS'd and ESS'd. I'm happy to return the favour. I have some questions for you: - Where did you end up permanently mounting the button. Any good pics? - If you did want to drill a hole, where would you consider good places to put it? I saw a pic of an M6 with the button in the center console. That looked pretty good. I'm thinking I might like the button to be as close as possible to the DSC button, but it would be great to get your thoughts. - Are you still running the supersprint X pipe, or any other changes? What I would really like is to go to stage 2.5 with ESS (when it eventually comes out) and have a method to switch between low (or no) boost and full boost. One button for power. One for noise. As you can see like you I am a bit obsessed with the Jykel and Hyde possibilities. And thanks for the awesome write up and video!!! You made the decision real easy for me. |
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09-15-2010, 03:10 AM | #21 | |
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Woot. Congrats on the order I'm still loving mine. KKS is extremely fast to respond.
One of the components (solenoid which control the flap) was damaged and I had KKS replace it for me really quick - and it was only after a long time before that happened (plus many track days in between) I'm running stock everything except for KKS mufflers. No, i didnt drill a hole. Instead I have it located on my steering wheel column where i can easily access it. I'll try to get some pics. Drilling is more or less a permanent thing and I didn't want to kill my trims (have to replace them later) just for that. I'm waiting for VT2-550 Was already so tempted to cross over to having a M3 with ESS. Ryan Quote:
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09-15-2010, 03:39 AM | #22 |
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Cool thanks. Originally I was going to wait for the VT2-550 but did you notice how long it took for the VT1 to come out? I couldn't allow myself to risk having to wait months and months, and plus I don't think you save much money by doing it all at once. The kit is designed to be added to in stages, so why not do it that way? Plus, you get to experience 2 fantastic power increases, instead of just one big huge one.
I'm sort of happy it has worked out this way, but you can bet I'll be hassling Roman for updates on availability of the VT2 every couple of months. Thanks, some pics would be great! No rush though. I have a 5 week wait ahead of me. My only solace is I have a gleaming new supercharger to keep me company, and that aint bad. :-)))) Last edited by VMZ432; 09-15-2010 at 04:04 AM.. |
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