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      01-26-2012, 01:05 PM   #1
Gt4
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Question on coilover rear, 5 speed tranny, no rear swaybar on Z4M Coupe?

I sold my E46 M3 track before Christmas and I might buy an Z4M Coupe in the next weeks.

I would like to know if you can set suspension the same way as an E46 M3?

Anyone running coilover rears? What kind of spring rate do you have?

Anyone running without a rear swaybar?


Did someone try a 5 speed swap in an Z4M Coupe? I know a 4.10 is a good starting point but you can shave some weight with the 5 speed swap in the E46 M3 and a flywheel/clutch setup?


Thanks


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      01-26-2012, 01:12 PM   #2
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I don't have time for a long reply. Search, lots on those topics here. Quickly for the M:

4.10 or 3.9 gears available. Many threads.
E36 front end, not E46 front end.
M3 transmission will not fit this car.
Coilover spring rates and types largely depend on the intended use. Some run 400/500 500/600 for track; others like the ~200/250 (IIRC on rate) H&R coilovers for street. See recent H&R Coilover thread.

What is your intended use of the car, what are your goals, etc.? Looks? Hardcore track rat? ????
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      01-26-2012, 02:52 PM   #3
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I would like to make a "street legal" track car/weekend warrior. I want something as fast as my ex E46 M3 track car without going that extreme/gutting the car. So I'm looking to compensate with power.
http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=316864

I would like coilovers in the same price range as KW Clubsport or TcKline DA, something 2way of decent quality. I will most likely run R6 for Time Attack and R-comp for track days.

So the E46 M3 6speed Getrag tranny isn't the same as the one in the Z4M Coupe?

I know the front suspension is similar to the E36 but can I buy a complete set of coilover from an E36? Is the rear going to fit?

Quote:
Some run 400/500 500/600 for track
This seems pretty similar spring rates as E46 M3.
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      01-26-2012, 03:45 PM   #4
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Okay, the intended use helps. I take it you have a lot of HPDE experience and know what you want in a setup. Cool.

First, it's a ZF Type H gearbox IIRC. M3 transmission would not fit.

Best power mods come with Euro Headers (no cats in Euro, which are used for cold start emissions) and probably a tune (ESS). This thread will help you get started. Lots to do though, since you'll need to relocate the secondary O2s and EGT, or find Euro Cats and possibly Euro O2 sensors.

Those with the 3.9 or 4.1 gears can chime in on that topic, but I seem to recall 3.9 had advantages on track vs. 4.1. BMW Motorsports did, at one time, make 3.9 gears. Not anymore, best solution I think is diffsonline for either set.

TCKline, Ground Control, and others sell coil sets for the Z4M that account for the largely E36 front end and E46 rear end. Camber plates are an option, so is the cheap solution of camber washers from Turner. Stock you can get around -1.0 up front, coils and lowering will give more of course.

Swaybar link to get started. I can't find the thread, but last summer someone with stiffer sways and high rate springs and a lot of track days ended up with broken front mount. If you go this route, you might want to have it reinforced.

IDK, maybe try a run stock at the track, with the exception of maybe more negative camber up front (for reasons of tire wear, and pretty much needed with R rated tires from what I hear), and see what you think then. The car has some unique handling characteristics. Guys like The Hack are light years more advanced than I am in describing this, and of course driving style and skill are major variables--so again maybe try it and then figure out where to play with settings? The stock setup is pretty darn good with just a good alignment IMO. Here's a thread on this topic, with very good discussion, and input from some very knowledgeable people on this forum.

I'd change the transmission mounts in any case, but folks around here know I'm always saying that. See the sticky.
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      01-26-2012, 08:09 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gtfour View Post
I sold my E46 M3 track before Christmas and I might buy an Z4M Coupe in the next weeks.

I would like to know if you can set suspension the same way as an E46 M3?
Define "set" suspension. It's all the same, the front is a MacPherson Strut and the rear is the same identical 4 link design. So nearly every adjustment that can be done on an E46 M3 to improve handling, like camber, caster (if you have a camber plate with caster adjustment), toe, ride-height, compression, rebound...etc, depending on what system you're running, yield somewhat similar results. The main difference is the wheel-base here, the MZ4 Coupe is obviously much shorter, resulting in less force required for it to rotate on the polar inertia. Other than that, the MZ4 Coupe is basically just a shorter, lighter, and lower E46 M3.

However, if you mean "set" like if E46 M3 suspension will work on an MZ4 Coupe, the answer is NO. ONLY the rear will work, the front is a hybrid between a bunch of different parts bin components. It's far more like an E36 M3 than E46 up front.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gtfour
Anyone running coilover rears? What kind of spring rate do you have?
Do you mean REAL coilovers instead of a simple adjustable collar on shorter and stiffer springs? It's going to require significant reinforcement in the attachment point, especially on the upper part of the shock mount, just like any BMW made in recent history. It's impractical and difficult to execute, but I would think if it can be done on any E36 and E46, there's no reason why the rears can't be a coilover design.

As far as spring rate is concerned for a coilover rear, this is WAY above my pay-grade.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gtfour
Anyone running without a rear swaybar?
IMO, the rear bar isn't really all that thick to start with, and while running without it may potentially reduce the snap oversteer tendencies, the problem with this chassis still reside mostly in the front. Remove the rear bar will likely exacerbate the initial understeer inherent in this chassis, although I haven't experimented with it and can't tell for sure if it will.

There are other things to address on this chassis before I'll even look at swaybars.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gtfour
Did someone try a 5 speed swap in an Z4M Coupe? I know a 4.10 is a good starting point but you can shave some weight with the 5 speed swap in the E46 M3 and a flywheel/clutch setup?
Why would you want that? The 6 speed unit in the MZ4 Coupe is probably lighter and more efficient than most of the 5 speed you'll find that will actually fit. It's got the latest generation ZF transmission with significantly lightened and smaller internals. I would be VERY surprised if you'll find any 5 speed that is lighter.
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      01-28-2012, 01:39 AM   #6
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Has anyone done the calculations on the Effective Wheel Rate? Thanks for all the info.
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      02-11-2012, 04:20 PM   #7
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I won't be able to run the car stock at the track. Next weekend I will buy a Z4M Coupe with those mods:

-ESS VT-1 445 S/C Kit
-Autosolutions SSK
-APR CF adjustable front spltter / OE CF Rear Spoiler
-TMS Camber Adjusting Bolt kit,
-SS Brake lines with caliper brass bushing Kit
-Wheel Stud
-3D Designs Gauge Pod with Boost,Coolant Temp & Oil Pressure Gauges
-BMS Exhaust (X-pipe & Mufflers)
-Apex Arc 18" wheels (9" ft/10"rr) with 245/40 ft & 285/35 rr -V12 tires


I think it's a good car with a lot of potential. I think I will put some KW Clubsport, catless headers, PF01 pads and a 4.10 diff this summer to make the car really fun at the track.

There is some advantages to use the ZF 5 speed tranny over the Getrag 6 speed unit on E46 M3. The gearbox itself is 20lbs lighter. You can find them for $300-500. E46 M3 6 speed are more in the $1200-1500 range. And you can have spare parts for the ZF unit, only diffonline can rebuilt the E46 M3 Getrag. And I hears the ZF is more reliable than the Getrag gearbox.

But since the gearbox is different in Z4M Coupe than E46 M3, I will forget the 5 speed swap idea.
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