[cupholder]

Anyone wish to try and suggest a purchasing path?

Been saving for quite a while and had planned to purchase a 2 yr old m340i, but head has been turned with m50...

Would probably plan to keep each for 5 or 6 years. From my calculations over this period, I don't think there is much between them, if anything the m50 will be cheaper, as I think I'd be left with an more expensive motor at the end of the period.

Situation:
- kids are teenages, so small rear cabin not a massive issue (plus were not a tall family)
- only do trips 200+ miles, 2 or 3 times a year
- treating myself for a big birthday
- I'm tight, so not leasing, will buy outright
- in the UK

As I see it:

m50
pro's
- would get to spec. myself
- new car new tech
- love the car and the front cabin
- range not a big issue
- cheap to run
- is the future
- i doubt batteries will change much, so should hold value ok

cons
- heavy car
- will not it be as much fun to drive as a m340i
- intial cost higher (will get a loan for 15k to allow purchase, pay back over 2/3 yrs)
- rear is tight for when I will carry adults
- can't get until late 2022, probably wait until March 2023

m340i
pros
- could buy tomorrow
- more cabin space
- lovely engine, decent car
cons
- used motor
- higher onging running costs (tax, fuel, servicing)
- surely prices will tumble as we get closer to 2030

Not sure the lack of driver involvement will bother me too much, I mean I'm older and shouldn't be racing about often, so I think the grand tourer might be a better fit.
Currently have a F30 320d M Sport, which has low mileage and I've not long put new rubber on each corner.

Test driving a m50 this coming week, so that will be interesting...

I think I'd be happy with both but the m50 edges it, since it's be brand new.

Thanks for reading and sorry, if this isn't of interest to others, or if this shouldn't really be posted here, I guess I'm a little curious as to others thoughts...

[ramparts]

Originally Posted by cupholder

Anyone wish to try and suggest a purchasing path?

Been saving for quite a while and had planned to purchase a 2 yr old m340i, but head has been turned with m50...

Would probably plan to keep each for 5 or 6 years. From my calculations over this period, I don't think there is much between them, if anything the m50 will be cheaper, as I think I'd be left with an more expensive motor at the end of the period.

Situation:
- kids are teenages, so small rear cabin not a massive issue (plus were not a tall family)
- only do trips 200+ miles, 2 or 3 times a year
- treating myself for a big birthday
- I'm tight, so not leasing, will buy outright
- in the UK

As I see it:

m50
pro's
- would get to spec. myself
- new car new tech
- love the car and the front cabin
- range not a big issue
- cheap to run
- is the future
- i doubt batteries will change much, so should hold value ok

cons
- heavy car
- will not it be as much fun to drive as a m340i
- intial cost higher (will get a loan for 15k to allow purchase, pay back over 2/3 yrs)
- rear is tight for when I will carry adults
- can't get until late 2022, probably wait until March 2023

m340i
pros
- could buy tomorrow
- more cabin space
- lovely engine, decent car
cons
- used motor
- higher onging running costs (tax, fuel, servicing)
- surely prices will tumble as we get closer to 2030

Not sure the lack of driver involvement will bother me too much, I mean I'm older and shouldn't be racing about often, so I think the grand tourer might be a better fit.
Currently have a F30 320d M Sport, which has low mileage and I've not long put new rubber on each corner.

Test driving a m50 this coming week, so that will be interesting...

I think I'd be happy with both but the m50 edges it, since it's be brand new.

Thanks for reading and sorry, if this isn't of interest to others, or if this shouldn't really be posted here, I guess I'm a little curious as to others thoughts...

Used cars are still keeping a lot of their value. Why not buy a used 340i for now, and run it for a year until a built i4 arrives in 12 months time for you. And you can always pull out if you like the 340 more

[cruzer666]

Originally Posted by cupholder

Anyone wish to try and suggest a purchasing path?

Been saving for quite a while and had planned to purchase a 2 yr old m340i, but head has been turned with m50...

I had a 2020 M340 xDrive for about a year and change. Having drive the M340 xDrive vs M50 which is also an xDrive car, I'd say driving dynamics won't be different to an extreme, they're both m-lite cars.

My thoughts:
1) As a driver you'd be more comfortable in the M50 due to rear air suspension.
2) the fact the GC is a hatch , you'll have an easier time fitting stuff in the trunk
3) If I were given the same choice as you I would also go with the M50 just because it's a new car. If you were to order a new M340, and I wouldn't have had one before, I would probably go with the M340.

Someone tried to make this point but his message didn't come across: the gas engine cars are at the peak of their technological capabilities, they will never get much better than they are today. The electric cars are just at their beginning stages with sky being the limit in terms of technological advancements. Not an easy choice for sure. Good luck !

[Rich9600]

Just leaving a 340i for a M50. It feels the natural evolution.

My 340i is a previous generation 2016 F31 and has served me well. However, in 5 years with a young family we have never done more than 250 miles in a day.

The hatch is fine now we are away from a pram and have a tow bar specified for rear carried bikes.

I did the sums back in November when I ordered and at about 9k miles a year it would take 6 years to cover the extra cost, spec for spec. The i4 carried a 4.9% pcp vs 2.9% on the BMW ICE variant. So, £6k hidden cost…

However, on a 6 year cost plan, in 2028 ICE will be 2 years from being banned in the UK. I wonder on the residual value of a large petrol engine. Niche and full M cars will hold more value than normal cars in my estimation. So, residuals and ever increasing fuel costs could further favour EV's.

The i4 M50 is a very different car to my 340i, it's a GT car to me. It fits my needs right now perfectly with 19's for a 250 mile real summer range.

[cupholder]

Thank you very much for your input here guys, much food for thought and appreciated.

I've never bought a new car from a dealer before, any tips on negotiating a purchase? Or what kind of discount I should try and push for?

Currently my plan is:
- Let them know that I'm looking at a loaded Tesla Model 3 and a Polestar 2
- Cash only deal
- Willing to place order but not commit unless I see a discount inline with my expectations (5%), I don't know if this is realistic or not... Going to try and start at 5.5%

[Rich9600]

Originally Posted by cupholder

Thank you very much for your input here guys, much food for thought and appreciated.

I've never bought a new car from a dealer before, any tips on negotiating a purchase? Or what kind of discount I should try and push for?

Currently my plan is:
- Let them know that I'm looking at a loaded Tesla Model 3 and a Polestar 2
- Cash only deal
- Willing to place order but not commit unless I see a discount inline with my expectations (5%), I don't know if this is realistic or not... Going to try and start at 5.5%

Good luck with that. Discounts are almost non-existent now. But, your trade in is your card to play.

I got ~20% off my 340i in 2016 and effectively paid £37k. But, I could get bugger all off back in November. It's still pre-order and getting towards sold out… I doubt any meaningful discounts until the market stabilises.

My 6 year old 340i is a ridiculous £22k trade in!

Edit: Dealer offer was November trade in offer held to delivery and 4 year GAP thrown in. Dealer claimed GAP was £800…

[cupholder]

FYI - I liked the car a lot. They offered me a £500 discount. I'll probably order one in a few weeks...

[cruzer666]

Originally Posted by cupholder

FYI - I liked the car a lot. They offered me a £500 discount. I'll probably order one in a few weeks...

Oh good. Some healthy dealer competition on orders. How much down payment ?

[cupholder]

Ordered this morning, the best I could was negotiate a £1k discount.
£500 down to reserve build, expected Q4.

[blazesquall]

I've had a 2020 m340i for the last two years, but will be turning it over when the m50 gets in. I've loved it, but have an EV itch I want to scratch.

[spool twice]

I'm excited to see owners reviews of this who've come from an M340i to the i4 M50 as it seems they somewhat are direct "competitors" in some form, just in different area's of a similar market.

[paulbazoV2]

Originally Posted by cupholder

Anyone wish to try and suggest a purchasing path?

Been saving for quite a while and had planned to purchase a 2 yr old m340i, but head has been turned with m50...

Would probably plan to keep each for 5 or 6 years. From my calculations over this period, I don't think there is much between them, if anything the m50 will be cheaper, as I think I'd be left with an more expensive motor at the end of the period.

Situation:
- kids are teenages, so small rear cabin not a massive issue (plus were not a tall family)
- only do trips 200+ miles, 2 or 3 times a year
- treating myself for a big birthday
- I'm tight, so not leasing, will buy outright
- in the UK

As I see it:

m50
pro's
- would get to spec. myself
- new car new tech
- love the car and the front cabin
- range not a big issue
- cheap to run
- is the future
- i doubt batteries will change much, so should hold value ok

cons
- heavy car
- will not it be as much fun to drive as a m340i
- intial cost higher (will get a loan for 15k to allow purchase, pay back over 2/3 yrs)
- rear is tight for when I will carry adults
- can't get until late 2022, probably wait until March 2023

m340i
pros
- could buy tomorrow
- more cabin space
- lovely engine, decent car
cons
- used motor
- higher onging running costs (tax, fuel, servicing)
- surely prices will tumble as we get closer to 2030

Not sure the lack of driver involvement will bother me too much, I mean I'm older and shouldn't be racing about often, so I think the grand tourer might be a better fit.
Currently have a F30 320d M Sport, which has low mileage and I've not long put new rubber on each corner.

Test driving a m50 this coming week, so that will be interesting...

I think I'd be happy with both but the m50 edges it, since it's be brand new.

Thanks for reading and sorry, if this isn't of interest to others, or if this shouldn't really be posted here, I guess I'm a little curious as to others thoughts...

You are comparing buying a used 2 year old M340 vs a brand new M50, and mention that the M50 would be cheaper? I am not clear on that, but I have a M340 and will get the M50 when my order gets fulfilled, probably end of this year.

[Giggler]

I'm an M340i owner with an EV scratch also, have recently been enjoying my time in the 330e and definitely see why people want to convert. But I've been reading and watching lots of reviews on the i4 e40 and the m50 and I'm convinced not to buy after taking it all in.


The main deal breakers for me:
It's still a 3-series chassis retrofitted for the electric drive train, so you have stuff like a useless driveshaft tunnel running through the cabin and obstructing the back seating area and a front trunk that is not usable despite being void of an engine. There could be other compromises that were made if you put the car under a microscope, but those are the standout ones.

The grand couple suffers from almost unusable back seats, and the electric version with a raised floor is even more unusable. Theirs plenty of video reviews of people awkwardly sitting back there to prove my point better than what I can describe with words. The plus side of this is that the car is a hatch, so you have a more usable trunk. So you have to decide if the tradeoff is worth it for your individual use scenario.

All the reviews I've seen comment on how heavy the i50 is when you push it around corners. I already think my M340 feels too heavy, and I'm not willing to sacrifice the driving dynamics further.


Also, i don't know if I'm sold on the new iDrive 8. They have gone and taken away more buttons for a simplified and minimal dash area. But buttons are important for quickly accessing certain functions of the car and IMO removing the buttons compromises overall usability.

My guess is that BMW is going to retire gas engines at the end of the G20 lifespan in 3 years or so, and a bespoke electric chassis will come out around that time. I would rather wait it out and continue to drive and enjoy my B58 twin-scroll turbo for 3 or 4 more years.

Hope my thoughts and ramblings as an M340 owner help you decide.

Edit:
I should maybe point out that I am almost convinced to buy the e40 version of the car based on this review by Joe Achilles, and it would be the one for me if I were going to buy one. But the M50 is a definite no for me.

[techwhiz1]

Originally Posted by Giggler

I'm an M340i owner with an EV scratch also, have recently been enjoying my time in the 330e and definitely see why people want to convert. But I've been reading and watching lots of reviews on the i4 e40 and the m50 and I'm convinced not to buy after taking it all in.


The main deal breakers for me:
It's still a 3-series chassis retrofitted for the electric drive train, so you have stuff like a useless driveshaft tunnel running through the cabin and obstructing the back seating area and a front trunk that is not usable despite being void of an engine. There could be other compromises that were made if you put the car under a microscope, but those are the standout ones.

The grand couple suffers from almost unusable back seats, and the electric version with a raised floor is even more unusable. Theirs plenty of video reviews of people awkwardly sitting back there to prove my point better than what I can describe with words. The plus side of this is that the car is a hatch, so you have a more usable trunk. So you have to decide if the tradeoff is worth it for your individual use scenario.

All the reviews I've seen comment on how heavy the i50 is when you push it around corners. I already think my M340 feels too heavy, and I'm not willing to sacrifice the driving dynamics further.


Also, i don't know if I'm sold on the new iDrive 8. They have gone and taken away more buttons for a simplified and minimal dash area. But buttons are important for quickly accessing certain functions of the car and IMO removing the buttons compromises overall usability.

My guess is that BMW is going to retire gas engines at the end of the G20 lifespan in 3 years or so, and a bespoke electric chassis will come out around that time. I would rather wait it out and continue to drive and enjoy my B58 twin-scroll turbo for 3 or 4 more years.

Hope my thoughts and ramblings as an M340 owner help you decide.

I wish people would do some research. It's not retrofitted for EV; the chassis was designed from day 1 you house BEV, ICE and Hybrid. The next platform will be designed with BEV as a priority but will still support ICE.

The tunnel houses cables.and battery modules. It's not useless.

Why do people keep arguing frunk? I don't want to store my crap under the hood. If it was automatic open/close then it might matter, but it isn't. Also the I4 M50 is not void of an engine in the front.

I wouldn't call the back seats unusable. I'm about 5'7" and I find them okay with someone my height in the front. In a grand coupe of this size the floor height might change but other aspects will not.

Unless you drive the car you can't judge the dynamics. I'm coming from an E90 which has probably the best dynamics of BMWs in the last 20 years. I like the M50 about as much as my E90 it's different and didn't feel heavy. It felt planted and solid but not heavy.

All I can say is iDrive 8 is better than Tesla by a order of magnitude.

They aren't retiring gas engines and will still design the platform as shared but with BEV as the priority.

If you have a functioning car not at the end of its life there is not any reason to trade your car to get an M50. I had a 2008 E90 with 250k miles and I was ready to convert to a track car. After I placed a deposit on the i4 my car was totaled. So I found myself needing a car. So this fits the bill.

[Giggler]

Originally Posted by techwhiz1

I wish people would do some research. It's not retrofitted for EV; the chassis was designed from day 1 you house BEV, ICE and Hybrid. The next platform will be designed with BEV as a priority but will still support ICE.

The tunnel houses cables.and battery modules. It's not useless.

Why do people keep arguing frunk? I don't want to store my crap under the hood. If it was automatic open/close then it might matter, but it isn't. Also the I4 M50 is not void of an engine in the front.

I wouldn't call the back seats unusable. I'm about 5'7" and I find them okay with someone my height in the front. In a grand coupe of this size the floor height might change but other aspects will not.

Unless you drive the car you can't judge the dynamics. I'm coming from an E90 which has probably the best dynamics of BMWs in the last 20 years. I like the M50 about as much as my E90 it's different and didn't feel heavy. It felt planted and solid but not heavy.

All I can say is iDrive 8 is better than Tesla by a order of magnitude.

They aren't retiring gas engines and will still design the platform as shared but with BEV as the priority.

If you have a functioning car not at the end of its life there is not any reason to trade your car to get an M50. I had a 2008 E90 with 250k miles and I was ready to convert to a track car. After I placed a deposit on the i4 my car was totaled. So I found myself needing a car. So this fits the bill.

Nothing worse than an apologist for bad car design:

1. you're claiming the tunnel running through the cabin was not intended to house a drive axel as its primary function? you're arguing that they could not have routed their electrical in a more efficient way that doesn't compromise interior cabin space given a choice of using a bespoke electric chassis design that does not make compromises?

2. are you calling every single qualified reviewer thus far who has pushed the 5000lbs+ M50 to its limits a liar for saying it feels heavy and unwieldy in a corner?

3. are you saying a car with a functional front trunk is no better than a car that doesn't have one due to poor chassis design? The Tesla M3 frunk for example is pretty big and you could fit a grocery haul in there.

4. are you calling every single qualified reviewer thus far a liar for saying the back seats of the grand coupe are only adequate for children and smaller adults? You're 5'-7, so that makes you a somewhat smaller adult, and so your opinion really means nothing for those of us closer to or above 6'. It's as if you intentionally fail to understand the context of the complaint.

5. and in case you didn't get the memo because it's in the title of this thread and i said as much in my reply, I OWN THE M340i! I literally drive the same G-chassis as the i4 every day... so of course I'm going to have an inkling of what the driving dynamics of the i4 feel like despite not having driven one personally. In fact, in the context of the thread titled, "m340i vs i4 m50"... I'm more qualified to answer this posters question based on three years of driving my M340i than you are with your single test drive in the M50! Thomas and James of ThrottleHouse (the reviewer I probably go to most besides Joe Achilles for BMW content) said it best that the M340i (specifically compared to the M50), "still feels like the most enjoyable and most purposeful way to enjoy this type of BMW"

edit: and just to make my point clear: i'm not saying this isn't the right car for some people, but i've stated some very factual objections about the car's weight and chassis design that aren't a matter of opinion... and those objections may be the reason why someone like myself chooses not to buy one.

[techwhiz1]

Originally Posted by Giggler

Nothing worse than an apologist for bad car design:

1. you're claiming the tunnel running through the cabin was not intended to house a drive axel as its primary function? you're arguing that they could not have routed their electrical in a more efficient way that doesn't compromise interior cabin space given a choice of using a bespoke electric chassis design that does not make compromises?

2. are you calling every single qualified reviewer thus far who has pushed the 5000lbs+ M50 to its limits a liar for saying it feels heavy and unwieldy in a corner?

3. are you saying a car with a functional front trunk is no better than a car that doesn't have one due to poor chassis design? The Tesla M3 frunk for example is pretty big and you could fit a grocery haul in there.

4. are you calling every single qualified reviewer thus far a liar for saying the back seats of the grand coupe are only adequate for children and smaller adults? You're 5'-7, so that makes you a somewhat smaller adult, and so your opinion really means nothing for those of us closer to or above 6'. It's as if you intentionally fail to understand the context of the complaint.

5. and in case you didn't get the memo because it's in the title of this thread and i said as much in my reply, I OWN THE M340i! I literally drive the same G-chassis as the i4 every day... so of course I'm going to have an inkling of what the driving dynamics of the i4 feel like despite not having driven one personally. In fact, in the context of the thread titled, "m340i vs i4 m50"... I'm more qualified to answer this posters question based on three years of driving my M340i than you are with your single test drive in the M50! Thomas and James of ThrottleHouse (the reviewer I probably go to most besides Joe Achilles for BMW content) said it best that the M340i (specifically compared to the M50), "still feels like the most enjoyable and most purposeful way to enjoy this type of BMW"

edit: and just to make my point clear: i'm not saying this isn't the right car for some people, but i've stated some very factual objections about the car's weight and chassis design that aren't a matter of opinion... and those objections may be the reason why someone like myself chooses not to buy one.

1. I'm saying that it's not a retrofited chassis and they use the tunnel for batteries, etc. So while there is a tunnel, they found some stuff to put in it.

2. I'm not calling them wrong, but it's subjective. I had time with the car and it'd fine in my opinion. All the reviews are opinions.

3. What I'm saying is a frunk isn't mandatory and if I have to walk up and open it, I'm not using it.

4. Qualified reviewer? I'm a qualified reviewer for my needs. The back seat has more room than my E90 had. YMMV

5. That's fine and it's "your opinion". I was giving a my opinion coming from multiple M3s and an E90.

YMMV.

My car will be here soon

[cruzer666]

Originally Posted by Giggler

edit: and just to make my point clear: i'm not saying this isn't the right car for some people, but i've stated some very factual objections about the car's weight and chassis design that aren't a matter of opinion... and those objections may be the reason why someone like myself chooses not to buy one.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion! You're no exception!

As far as factual objections:
- you mentioned I4 is a 3 series chassis converted to electric. This is not factual, the I4 is using the CLAR platform that was designed from scratch and built to accommodate both electric motors and an ICE engine + transmission
- you said the floor is raised on the electric version of the 4 series making the rear seats unusable , both ICE and BEV versions of the 4 series have exactly 36.6 inches of headroom

As far as driving dynamics, myself, like most of the people here have owned a M340 for an extended period of time and we have also test driven the i4 M50. Based on your thoughts, it seems like you haven't driven the M50 yet. It is very unlikely you will be able to tell it's weight driving it on public roads. Yes, you'll feel the weight taking it on the track, but this isn't a track car. As far as reviews go, we typically see negative reviews on the I4 from people that don't take much time to research the vehicle, or are anti-EV and resistant to change. Many get hung up on the M badge.

If you do end up driving it, you may find out, like many of us previous M340 owners, that it feels like an M340. I would be curious to read your thoughts after you drive it.

Enjoy!

[Aalfred]

As mentioned before, everyone has different reason for choosing a car. I think if you own an m340i, you probably arent getting anything significantly different except for savings on gas money and maybe that instant torque which might be old after the first 1000 miles.

As for the rear seat, i agree, its not ideal but in the US most of us are moving to an SUV as a family car and the daily driver might be a single or 2 person car. The occasional carrying kids for short distances or maybe friends for quick get togethers, it should serve its purpose. For long distances, its definitely not made to be a 4 person car esp for those taller than 5’10”. The “hump” in the middle is a feature of ALL BMW cars and likely due to their AWD design. Its even on SUV. I chose the X3 over the Audi Q5, becoz the “hump” was shorter. Only when u move up to a Audi Q7 or maybe X7 the hump is less obvious. If you are looking for a dedicated EV chassis, keep in mind the price will also be high. The IX is as expensive as a Model X and is a dedicated EV chassis.

I dont get what the big deal about the Frunk is about. I mean we dont have a frunk is any of the ICE cars and we r perfectly happy. The I4 is a GC and has a lot of trunk space. I looked at a 5 series and laughed when the SA said it had the largest trunk space in its category. That thing couldnt even fit a large stroller or double stroller. So a GC design will serve most peoples needs than a frunk. You have the foot activated option to help with ur hands free option but i think we r kinda being too picky reg the Frunk. In my opinion, id rather have a hatchback without a frunk than a frunk with a small narrow trunk ( hey now that rhymes ..lol)

As for the m badge, I dont think BMW named it M50 to be as an EV version of M cars. We have a lot of M-lite cars which have preppy performance than the standard one but below the actual M car. I didnt see so much uproar for having the M-lite cars. Why not consider it a M-Lite version of the I4 and it should be a no brainer.

Like you said, everyone is in this for different reasons, so this may not be the car you are looking for. But for most ofus here, the reasons you have chosen are easily overlooked as our needs are different and I4 M50 fits those needs.

Cheers

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by cruzer666

Someone tried to make this point but his message didn't come across: the gas engine cars are at the peak of their technological capabilities, they will never get much better than they are today. The electric cars are just at their beginning stages with sky being the limit in terms of technological advancements. Not an easy choice for sure. Good luck !

If the above is true, then BEV is likely to follow Moore's law and computer pricing, e.g. twice the performance at the same price every few years.

There are some who also believe BEV tech is plateauing until the next battery tech and such, so it does not make sense to wait out.

My leaning is towards the Moore's law crowd, that is, waiting out does not hurt.

[cruzer666]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

If the above is true, then BEV is likely to follow Moore's law and computer pricing, e.g. twice the performance at the same price every few years.

There are some who also believe BEV tech is plateauing until the next battery tech and such, so it does not make sense to wait out.

My leaning is towards the Moore's law crowd, that is, waiting out does not hurt.

Sky is the limit for BEV's. There's really no way of knowing how much they'll advance.

To get a good idea on how much we have yet to see from BEVs is maybe looking back at the 20HP 4 cylinder engine in the ford Model T. Today we have 416HP 4 cylinder engines. That's what over a century of advancements got us on ICE vehicles.

For BEV's most of these advancements will come from battery tech, I don't know if we'll see 20X performance in 100 years though, but if we look at history, who knows!

[cupholder]

Originally Posted by paulbazoV2

You are comparing buying a used 2 year old M340 vs a brand new M50, and mention that the M50 would be cheaper? I am not clear on that, but I have a M340 and will get the M50 when my order gets fulfilled, probably end of this year.

Sorry, late coming back to this. As I said in my post I ran figures over a 6 year period and since I believe that the m50 will be worth more at the end of the period it works out cheaper.

Please remember that I wrote that pre-Ukraine war which has upset fuel & energy prices.