|
|
SUPPORT ZPOST BY DOING YOUR TIRERACK SHOPPING FROM THIS BANNER, THANKS! |
Post Reply |
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
01-27-2018, 11:56 AM | #1 |
Colonel
1211
Rep 2,931
Posts
Drives: Anything
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: SoCal
|
My oil analysis and rod bearings changed
I just had my bearings changed and wanted to share my findings with this great forum in order to provide additional data points on these finicky S54 engines. Attached is the accumulation of all the past Blackstone reports to date. The Blackstone oil analysis, works, for the most part if you want to keep an eye on bearing wear. Looking back, I should have done oil analysis way earlier than my first one at ~28K miles. My thought was that the engine shouldn’t have any issues with so few miles, especially on one of the final iterations of the S54 (mine was the last few hundreds S54 built). So, you can see my shocked face when I saw the lead reading on my first report at ~28K.
The car is mostly a weekend car with some commute to work (approx. 30-minute commute). Very few, if any, short trips. Always let the car get up to temp prior to seeing 4K+ rpm.
A couple of things that stood out to me regarding these oil analysis:
This further emphasize that these analysis only work if you use it to look at their trends. Someone who has never done an oil analysis and suddenly decides to do one at, say, 100k miles to see a very low lead readings can get a false sense of security thinking everything is all well. In any case, the decision had been made to have the bearings change out at ~55K miles due to a long streak of high lead readings no matter what the outcome was on the last report. The pictures speak for themselves. Definitely glad I had them replaced, but was very surprised to see their conditions for a well-loved and maintained (annual or ~5k mile oil changes) non-tracked car that is under 60K miles. I had decided to go with WPC simply because those had been around longer and not a single complain (that I know of) with them thus far. Lang Racing Development offered both WPC and BE Bearings for the same price - He doesn’t favor one over the other. With the VANOS already updated with Beisan stuffs and now bearings, I’m hoping that it won’t need touching for another 100K other than valve adjustments and basic maintenance. After all that, these reports raised another issue – rising sodium levels. I’m hoping sodium is part of the additives that I had been adding to the oil on the last 3 analysis – we’ll find out on the next report as I’m not running any additional additives on my current oil after the bearing change. I don’t think it’s antifreeze because I’m not losing any. I’m not sure why the report indicates a 0.23% antifreeze when Blackstone can’t conclude if the rise in sodium is caused by antifreeze due to the lack of potassium present? That 0.23% antifreeze is most likely “moisture” in the oil that they’re referring to since the sample was taken cold. Anyway - Any ideas what may cause a rise in sodium other than from antifreeze or oil additives? Last edited by XMetal; 01-27-2018 at 12:13 PM.. |
01-28-2018, 10:22 AM | #3 |
Captain
373
Rep 870
Posts
Drives: 2006 BMW Z4M Roadster
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: NC
|
Xmetal,
It sounds like we are following similar paths. I didn't try a different weight oil, but I did try Ceratec on my last oil change. In fact, it is in the car right now and will be changed within the next 100 miles. Our mileage is about the same. I suspect I will find the same bearing wear that you have. Did Lang have any opinion on Ceratec? My thought is that I know I need the bearings replaced and will be doing it soon. Since the most common failure is spun bearings, I was hoping if there was metal on metal contact (which clearly there is), it would slip over the Ceratec coating and not have enough friction to spin the bearing. Now that you have new bearings, will you continue to use Ceratec? Since the WPC bearings have the slicker surface and the BE bearings have the coated surface, I don't know that it is necessary or helpful, but I suppose Ceratec has other benefits other than the bearing shells. I was reading Loctite's literature the other day, and they have a product called 648. It may be that the Loctite would add too much thickness, but I wonder if anyone has ever tried adding that to the underside of the bearing shell where it interfaces with the rod. When I do my rod bearing swap, I'll post photos and results, as well. Salty
__________________
2006 BMW Z4M Interlagos Blue/Black
Aux Port|LED Interior|LED Strip Trunk|Underseat First Aid Box|Stubby Antenna|Intravee II|BMW Oil Change Kit|Top Down Side Panels|Vibra Technics Engine Mounts|Rogue Trans Mounts|Engine Mount Bolts Upgrade|RS Windblocker|Euro Front Plate|M5 Illum Shift Knob|Supersprint Powerloop Exhaust|Gruppe-M Intake|RPI Scoop|Black Grills|19x8.5 ET35 F 19x9.5 ET22 R Sportline 8s PSS| Besian Vanos|CDV Delete |
Appreciate
0
|
01-28-2018, 10:24 AM | #4 |
Captain
373
Rep 870
Posts
Drives: 2006 BMW Z4M Roadster
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: NC
|
Oh, and did the bearings feel slicker that had been run with Ceratec?
Thanks! Salty
__________________
2006 BMW Z4M Interlagos Blue/Black
Aux Port|LED Interior|LED Strip Trunk|Underseat First Aid Box|Stubby Antenna|Intravee II|BMW Oil Change Kit|Top Down Side Panels|Vibra Technics Engine Mounts|Rogue Trans Mounts|Engine Mount Bolts Upgrade|RS Windblocker|Euro Front Plate|M5 Illum Shift Knob|Supersprint Powerloop Exhaust|Gruppe-M Intake|RPI Scoop|Black Grills|19x8.5 ET35 F 19x9.5 ET22 R Sportline 8s PSS| Besian Vanos|CDV Delete |
Appreciate
0
|
01-28-2018, 10:25 AM | #5 |
Captain
373
Rep 870
Posts
Drives: 2006 BMW Z4M Roadster
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: NC
|
Oh, and what bolts did you go with? Man, I'm full of questions...or something.
Salty
__________________
2006 BMW Z4M Interlagos Blue/Black
Aux Port|LED Interior|LED Strip Trunk|Underseat First Aid Box|Stubby Antenna|Intravee II|BMW Oil Change Kit|Top Down Side Panels|Vibra Technics Engine Mounts|Rogue Trans Mounts|Engine Mount Bolts Upgrade|RS Windblocker|Euro Front Plate|M5 Illum Shift Knob|Supersprint Powerloop Exhaust|Gruppe-M Intake|RPI Scoop|Black Grills|19x8.5 ET35 F 19x9.5 ET22 R Sportline 8s PSS| Besian Vanos|CDV Delete |
Appreciate
0
|
01-28-2018, 11:31 AM | #6 | ||
Colonel
1211
Rep 2,931
Posts
Drives: Anything
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: SoCal
|
Quote:
I don’t have any additional additives in my current oil since I’m trying to isolate where the added sodium is coming from. I may use a Ceratec treatment in the future - they do advertised that it should last 30K or so. As long as wears are kept within check, I would like to stay away from any additional additives if possible because I don’t really want to mess around too much with the oil’s chemistry as originally intended by the manufacturer - Oil companies don't spend billions on R & D for nothing. My other reasoning was that if Ceratec was so effective as an anti-wear agent, why isn't it already in Liqui Moly's oil? Then again, may be Liqui Moly's oil already contain some Ceratec in it??? With that said, Lang did put Liqui Moly 10W60 in my engine after the bearing swap Quote:
I went with the OE bolts per Lang’s suggestion. He didn’t try to push any other options Last edited by XMetal; 01-28-2018 at 11:46 AM.. |
||
Appreciate
1
SaltyNC372.50 |
01-28-2018, 12:22 PM | #7 |
First Lieutenant
128
Rep 355
Posts |
now i'm second guessing myself. I recently did blackstone test with ceratec(28k)and my results were perfect. wish i has tested before adding it...
__________________
Ken B.(BMWCCA/PCA/ZSCCA/SCCA)
|
Appreciate
0
|
01-28-2018, 09:30 PM | #8 |
Brigadier General
3052
Rep 3,314
Posts
Drives: 2002 M5;2007 M Coupe;2020 M2C
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Tucson
|
Thanks for posting your experience. I'm at 30K and watching my lead levels...
__________________
2020 F87 M2C Hockenheim Silver/MT
2002 E39 M5 Sterling Gray/Caramel 2007 E86 Z4M Coupe Silver Gray/Black 2021 Kia Telluride (hauler) |
Appreciate
1
XMetal1211.00 |
01-29-2018, 10:57 AM | #9 |
Lieutenant
287
Rep 431
Posts |
Thanks for taking the time to post all of this excellent information! I am going to get mine done at 60K next month now, regardless of an oil analysis.
__________________
1995 E36 M3 | BMW CCA Club Racer - IP #34 | Gray / Blue / Orange | 261WHP | 2,700lbs
2013 E92 M3 Competition 6MT Slick Top | AW / Fox Red | 2006 E86 M Coupe | Silver Gray / Imola | JRZ RSTWO | APR Aero | Sparco Seats/Belts | Weichers Cage Gone: 2017 Audi Q7 | 2011 E93 328i 6MT | 2014 Audi A6 | 2010 VW CC 2.0T | 2011 G37 S Coupe 6MT | 2004 G35 Coupe | SW20 MR2 Widebody Turbo |
Appreciate
1
XMetal1211.00 |
01-30-2018, 12:40 PM | #10 |
Private First Class
35
Rep 159
Posts |
Great info! I had my bearings replaced around 50k miles and they looked very similar to yours, although I was driving the car at the track occasionally. I was always diligent about oil changes and engine warm up.
Interestingly enough, my car now has around 95k miles (but 75k miles on the replacement engine and 35k miles on the set of VAC coated bearings), and I am showing elevated copper with no increase in lead. I don't know the composition of the other engine bearings, but I imagine it is now either the camshaft, small end connecting rod, or main bearings that are wearing. This is assuming the VAC bearings are still lead over copper, just with an additional coating. |
Appreciate
1
XMetal1211.00 |
01-30-2018, 09:56 PM | #11 |
Captain
373
Rep 870
Posts
Drives: 2006 BMW Z4M Roadster
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: NC
|
Thanks for the info, Xmetal, and glad you didn't spin a bearing.
Salty
__________________
2006 BMW Z4M Interlagos Blue/Black
Aux Port|LED Interior|LED Strip Trunk|Underseat First Aid Box|Stubby Antenna|Intravee II|BMW Oil Change Kit|Top Down Side Panels|Vibra Technics Engine Mounts|Rogue Trans Mounts|Engine Mount Bolts Upgrade|RS Windblocker|Euro Front Plate|M5 Illum Shift Knob|Supersprint Powerloop Exhaust|Gruppe-M Intake|RPI Scoop|Black Grills|19x8.5 ET35 F 19x9.5 ET22 R Sportline 8s PSS| Besian Vanos|CDV Delete |
Appreciate
0
|
01-31-2018, 12:11 AM | #12 | |
Colonel
1211
Rep 2,931
Posts
Drives: Anything
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: SoCal
|
Quote:
Please post your results if and when you decides to do your bearings. Any/All data points will help everyone |
|
Appreciate
1
kaybat127.50 |
02-20-2018, 04:17 PM | #13 | |
Lieutenant
287
Rep 431
Posts |
Quote:
60K Miles and roughly 20 track days. Replacing with the WPC kit from ECS Tuning.
__________________
1995 E36 M3 | BMW CCA Club Racer - IP #34 | Gray / Blue / Orange | 261WHP | 2,700lbs
2013 E92 M3 Competition 6MT Slick Top | AW / Fox Red | 2006 E86 M Coupe | Silver Gray / Imola | JRZ RSTWO | APR Aero | Sparco Seats/Belts | Weichers Cage Gone: 2017 Audi Q7 | 2011 E93 328i 6MT | 2014 Audi A6 | 2010 VW CC 2.0T | 2011 G37 S Coupe 6MT | 2004 G35 Coupe | SW20 MR2 Widebody Turbo Last edited by Azeka1; 02-20-2018 at 04:41 PM.. |
|
Appreciate
0
|
02-20-2018, 09:51 PM | #14 |
Colonel
1211
Rep 2,931
Posts
Drives: Anything
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: SoCal
|
Those actually look really good! Now let see the rest of them
|
Appreciate
0
|
02-21-2018, 02:28 AM | #15 |
Dog Listener
711
Rep 7,850
Posts |
Wow. It's bearing season! Seems like we're all hit the ~50k mark and getting them done. I posted these on another thread but same use as your car and similar miles. Left is top, right bottom. Regardless of doing data collection or type of use I'm concluding this is a 40-60k (max) mile maintenance/insurance item.
|
Appreciate
0
|
02-21-2018, 09:15 AM | #16 |
Colonel
1211
Rep 2,931
Posts
Drives: Anything
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: SoCal
|
Finn,
Good call on the bearings. I'm very surprise to see how bad our bearings are compared to E46M3s with similar miles. Our engines are supposed to be the latest and greatest iterations, but data show otherwise. What bearings did you end up going with? |
Appreciate
0
|
02-21-2018, 07:46 PM | #17 |
Lieutenant
287
Rep 431
Posts |
Updated picture. Actually they did not look so good! Again, 60K miles and around 20 track days. Glad I saw your post and pulled the trigger.
__________________
1995 E36 M3 | BMW CCA Club Racer - IP #34 | Gray / Blue / Orange | 261WHP | 2,700lbs
2013 E92 M3 Competition 6MT Slick Top | AW / Fox Red | 2006 E86 M Coupe | Silver Gray / Imola | JRZ RSTWO | APR Aero | Sparco Seats/Belts | Weichers Cage Gone: 2017 Audi Q7 | 2011 E93 328i 6MT | 2014 Audi A6 | 2010 VW CC 2.0T | 2011 G37 S Coupe 6MT | 2004 G35 Coupe | SW20 MR2 Widebody Turbo |
Appreciate
1
XMetal1211.00 |
02-21-2018, 10:16 PM | #18 | |
Dog Listener
711
Rep 7,850
Posts |
Quote:
Your point is well taken on ours vs. the E46. These are out of my Z3M (new acquisition) with 84k miles. (Did this and the subframe upon purchase.) Worn, but, there's 2x the miles of the Z4M bearings in the post above and 25 track days on these. My developing theory is after the initial S54 bearing debacle sourcing of bearings and downstream processes were tightly controlled. (Clearly there are intrinsic design issues, but that wouldn't explain the model specific longevity differences.) That may have diminished with time and/or stocking levels of bearings, or with the plant doing the assembly. Was the S54 of the Z4M assembled in Georgia or Germany? |
|
Appreciate
1
XMetal1211.00 |
02-21-2018, 10:17 PM | #19 |
Colonel
1211
Rep 2,931
Posts
Drives: Anything
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: SoCal
|
Wow those do look bad. Very happy to see another one being saved
__________________
|
Appreciate
0
|
02-21-2018, 10:30 PM | #20 |
Dog Listener
711
Rep 7,850
Posts |
|
Appreciate
0
|
02-21-2018, 11:06 PM | #21 |
Where Does He Get Those Wonderful Toys?
93
Rep 290
Posts |
Finnegan My window sticker says
Country of origin engine and transmission: Germany final assembly point Spartanburg SC, USA |
Appreciate
0
|
02-21-2018, 11:46 PM | #22 |
Dog Listener
711
Rep 7,850
Posts |
My window sticker says country of origin engine and transmission: Germany final assembly point Spartanburg SC, USA[/QUOTE] Thanks! That eliminates a possibility. The diligence over time post crisis mode is still viable. Not provable. But typical in terms of human behavior. |
Appreciate
0
|
Post Reply |
Bookmarks |
|
|