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      07-09-2013, 11:31 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by The HACK View Post
Nitto NT-01. I've had them on the car (on the front, at least) since 2007. Assuming that they get 25 cycles* per year, I'd say they've got about 100 heat cycles on them already.

* Assuming 10 days a year average, and anywhere between 2-3 cycles per day
Damn wish i got that , screw heat cycles my NTO-1's only last 6 track days from wear!!
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      07-09-2013, 12:27 PM   #24
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When we go out and drive in our BMW CCA events, we were told in no certain terms are we to put a wheel or a tire off line, and any ass-hattery will subject you to a ban from the instructor corp in the Pacific Region. I ALWAYS drive during our events with 2/10th in reserve.

The difference in tire wear between 8/10th and 10/10th or 11/10th is HUGE. My rears are typically scrubs from club racer friends, shaved with anywhere between 2-5 heat cycles on them, and they still last about 1.5 seasons and ~10 days because I don't push hard.

If I were an attendee and "not embarrass myself" is not a prime directive, I doubt my tires would last nearly as long.

But NT-01s and the old RA-1 compound is very much alike in this regard, they last long despite heat cycles and are good to drive on until they cord. PERFECT for DE use.

I did 3 sessions on fresh Hoosier R-6es and those are pure crack cocaine. Holy unlimited grip batman. But the difference between the first session and the last session was very apparent.
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      07-10-2013, 08:39 AM   #25
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They must have some different policies in your region than in ours.

Our last driving school at Mid America Motorplex here was a realy wet one. We had at least two instructors go off far enough that the recovery crew didn't have a long enough strap to pull them out!
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      07-10-2013, 08:51 AM   #26
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When we go out and drive in our BMW CCA events, we were told in no certain terms are we to put a wheel or a tire off line, and any ass-hattery will subject you to a ban from the instructor corp in the Pacific Region. I ALWAYS drive during our events with 2/10th in reserve.

The difference in tire wear between 8/10th and 10/10th or 11/10th is HUGE. My rears are typically scrubs from club racer friends, shaved with anywhere between 2-5 heat cycles on them, and they still last about 1.5 seasons and ~10 days because I don't push hard.

If I were an attendee and "not embarrass myself" is not a prime directive, I doubt my tires would last nearly as long.

But NT-01s and the old RA-1 compound is very much alike in this regard, they last long despite heat cycles and are good to drive on until they cord. PERFECT for DE use.

I did 3 sessions on fresh Hoosier R-6es and those are pure crack cocaine. Holy unlimited grip batman. But the difference between the first session and the last session was very apparent.
Ah I see, but that sucks that you can not drive your car and improve your skills further. I would honestly get bored of driving at 7-8/10ths after awhile. The challenge of constantly bettering myself is part of what i enjoy the most about tracking. I assure you I do not embarrass myself when I have an occasional spin ( its been awhile but it will happen again), its part of what we do. And I certainly do not partake in ass-hattery lol. The goal of a DE is to teach the students how to control their cars in a safe environment, and better themselves as drivers. The policy of your region seems to stifle the improvement part significantly if they have that attitude towards their instructors. My condolences.
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      07-10-2013, 10:12 AM   #27
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We don't hold our attendees back. In fact in the Andvanced courses they're often pushed past 10/10th in a controlled manner. We hold our instructors to a very stringent standard. Occasionally I get the urge to sign up as an A+ student just so I can let loose the reigns. I tell ya, the A+ program in our region is a ton of fun.

But there are still plenty to learn at 8/10th, it's just your consumables wear much slower and the risk of getting kicked out of the corp decreases significantly.

Plus the incentives for me to drive 10/10th don't come around often enough (say, a buddy instructor in an E46 M3 were to catch up or vice versa).
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      08-22-2013, 04:16 PM   #28
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Great thread, I've been weighing my options on my next car and the e86m is very tempting again!...

Anybody know how the potential of the z4 35is is like on track?

Off topic but, my c6 z06 has proven to be the cheapest on consumables at the track. Rotors are $60, st43 pads $260, qt of 0-30 euro is $6, 25 mpg to track and back, tires last forever bc of the large contact patch and lightweight nature, car is ready to hit the track in stock configuration with very little improvement in times with suspension upgrades unless your thinking of motons. I may have just sold myself back to the z06, damn
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      09-26-2013, 02:03 PM   #29
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I definitely agree with the general consensus here. The practical way would have been the M3 but I love the M coupe on the limits.
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      10-06-2013, 10:51 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by The HACK View Post
The BIGGEST problem is once you move onto the interior, like cages (must be custom), seats (mostly custom), and electronics.
Having slowing evolved the car to be more track and less street, I have started running into a wall the last year and a half trying to decide on a good seat and roll bar/harness bar setup. I just cannot find something that will work well on track as well as give me comfort to drive to and from tracks (some tracks like Road Atlanta are 850miles one way, VIR is 550 mi, the Glen is 260 mi etc) and still retain the complete trunk. I wish I was a bit shorter, not that I am too tall at around 6'.

Spoke to HMS Motorsport at the Glen last weekend and they summed it up for me. They have built 2 custom roll bars and set setups in Z4s and said that while their customers loved the workmanship, they started to not like the car as much anymore. He said if I enjoy DEs and like the car, I should just keep it stock inside and have fun; if I want to go to the next step with seats, bar, harnesses and HANS, then I should consider getting an e46 M3 or an e36 M3.

Having instructed a few students in e92 M3s, I don't have a strong desire for that car anymore (I was planning on getting one as my next car a couple of years ago) just because it does not feel nimble and sprightly as the Z4MC. We'll see what the future brings but for now the Z4MC stays stock inside and I will keep DE'ing it as-is because the more I learn to drive this car closer to the limit, the more fun it becomes. It still challenges me every time I get behind the wheel at a race track.
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      10-06-2013, 06:46 PM   #31
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255/40/18 Hoosiers on 8.5in rims fit all 4 corners on my z4m provide incredible grip. Running 3deg neg camber up front and 1 rear to make fit. Rolled fenders but didn't need to. What prior post said about the way this car rotates and the feel of the slip angle at high g's has me hooked over my e90 335dinan for track days. I haven't tracked an e46 but cannot go wrong there either. I'm below 3000lbs and pull these easily on straights. But the Dinan is faster than both in straights.
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      10-30-2013, 05:03 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pal View Post
Having slowing evolved the car to be more track and less street, I have started running into a wall the last year and a half trying to decide on a good seat and roll bar/harness bar setup. I just cannot find something that will work well on track as well as give me comfort to drive to and from tracks (some tracks like Road Atlanta are 850miles one way, VIR is 550 mi, the Glen is 260 mi etc) and still retain the complete trunk. I wish I was a bit shorter, not that I am too tall at around 6'.

Spoke to HMS Motorsport at the Glen last weekend and they summed it up for me. They have built 2 custom roll bars and set setups in Z4s and said that while their customers loved the workmanship, they started to not like the car as much anymore. He said if I enjoy DEs and like the car, I should just keep it stock inside and have fun; if I want to go to the next step with seats, bar, harnesses and HANS, then I should consider getting an e46 M3 or an e36 M3.

Having instructed a few students in e92 M3s, I don't have a strong desire for that car anymore (I was planning on getting one as my next car a couple of years ago) just because it does not feel nimble and sprightly as the Z4MC. We'll see what the future brings but for now the Z4MC stays stock inside and I will keep DE'ing it as-is because the more I learn to drive this car closer to the limit, the more fun it becomes. It still challenges me every time I get behind the wheel at a race track.
That is strange that the guys at HMS said this, as I am one of the people that had a half cage installed with HMS involved (they actually did not install the cage, a person they recommended did, and they put in the Cobra seats) I actually like the car MUCH more than before the seats and half cage were installed. Car dropped abt 100lbs (taking into account the weight of the cage), I'm not sliding around in the seat, can use a HANS device and feel much more secure...BTW I am 6'2" and fit just fine WITH my helmet
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      10-30-2013, 09:23 PM   #33
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I own a Z4MC... And I say: M3 all the way.

A Much, much, MUCH more BALANCED car. The controllability is WAY better, and it's an easier car to drive fast on the track.

That said, I OWN/BOUGHT a Z4MC. It's a handful and has some seriously weird handling characteristics. With you butt hanging over the rear axel, it's an absolute HOOT! IMO it delivers WAY more of a the THRILL than the M3.

YMMV.
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      10-31-2013, 10:25 AM   #34
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Apart from a bit quicker rotation I don't find the m coupe altogether that different from the m3 at the limit. What sort of weird stuff are you talking about?

With 265's or 275's all around they both seem very similar to me. In either car I get tons of communication from both ends of the car so they never seem out of shape or surprising really.
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      10-31-2013, 10:47 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fullerra View Post
That is strange that the guys at HMS said this, as I am one of the people that had a half cage installed with HMS involved (they actually did not install the cage, a person they recommended did, and they put in the Cobra seats) I actually like the car MUCH more than before the seats and half cage were installed. Car dropped abt 100lbs (taking into account the weight of the cage), I'm not sliding around in the seat, can use a HANS device and feel much more secure...BTW I am 6'2" and fit just fine WITH my helmet
Can you PLEASE post pictures of the cage?
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      10-31-2013, 01:33 PM   #36
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Thanks for the continued feedback guys. I'm taking steps towards making my M3 a track car while leaving the Z4MC pretty stock.

My wife's been tracking the Z and it'll be a while before she outgrows it being completely stock.
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      10-31-2013, 02:05 PM   #37
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Thanks for the continued feedback guys. I'm taking steps towards making my M3 a track car while leaving the Z4MC pretty stock.

My wife's been tracking the Z and it'll be a while before she outgrows it being completely stock.
2 words

Track insurance

Lol
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      10-31-2013, 02:08 PM   #38
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2 words

Track insurance

Lol
oh yeah, got that covered.
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