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      12-04-2018, 01:21 PM   #133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by usshelena725 View Post
Chinese man arrested for taking pictures of US Navy base in Florida. Not only was he a Chinese national, but he was here illegally as well.

Super.

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/loc...222552930.html
We need a wall!!
FYI I waved at you as we flew over Tennessee. I'm in nyc today
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      12-04-2018, 01:27 PM   #134
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FYI I waved at you as we flew over Tennessee. I'm in nyc today
Nice - I am about 10 minutes from VA and about 40 minutes from NC, right up in the corner on top of the mountains. It's a nice place to be - although we are expected to get a foot of snow this weekend.

Did you pick your restaurant for your family 'date'?
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      12-06-2018, 09:38 AM   #135
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So the person arrested has requested that no information should be made public. The Chinese government is saying it's wrong to arrest a person without information being released.

I certainly chuckled at the Chinese govt statement.

Huawei arrest: China demands release of Meng Wanzhou http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46465768
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      12-06-2018, 09:42 AM   #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
So the person arrested has requested that no information should be made public. The Chinese government is saying it's wrong to arrest a person without information being released.

I certainly chuckled at the Chinese govt statement.

Huawei arrest: China demands release of Meng Wanzhou http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46465768
I saw this. My watch is made by Huawei. They have a good reputation related to reliability for electronics compared to most Chinese products.

I have mixed feelings about this. Arrested outside the USA with intention to extradite back to the USA for violating an embargo? Hmmm. Not sure that is the best plan of action.

Of course, I personally think embargo's are a terrible idea and only really hurt the civilian population of a country, not those in charge politically that are making the decisions that the USA is upset about.
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      12-06-2018, 03:26 PM   #137
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Huawei arrest: Justin Trudeau denies political motivation http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46471904
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      12-06-2018, 03:34 PM   #138
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I think the Chinese make nice aftermarket wheels. I do not think there is any spyware in them but who knows what might be in a Chinese TPMS module
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      12-26-2018, 03:01 PM   #139
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https://apnews.com/5fcff305a6e946d4bb3da548c7a6e9c7
Prominent Chinese rights lawyer tried in closed proceedings
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      12-26-2018, 03:52 PM   #140
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
https://apnews.com/5fcff305a6e946d4bb3da548c7a6e9c7
Prominent Chinese rights lawyer tried in closed proceedings
His organs will be up for sale on the black market shortly.
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      12-26-2018, 03:56 PM   #141
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Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
https://apnews.com/5fcff305a6e946d4bb3da548c7a6e9c7
Prominent Chinese rights lawyer tried in closed proceedings
But but, The Chinese government is saying it's wrong to arrest a person without information being released.

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      12-26-2018, 04:02 PM   #142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
No. Dictatorships typically have alliances with other dictatorships because they are less threatening than democracies (See Nazi Germany and Soviet
anti-agression pact, Nazi-Japan-Italy pact, current China-Russia-Syria-Venezuela backpatting). They abhor freedom of expression and a free press.

Why does China care what American Airlines says or advertises about Taiwan?
(Hint: The Taiwanese have a legitimate government that they chose. The Communist chinese govt. has no such legitamacy).
Exactly. Russia and China care little about their people. Leads to the elite that cozy up to the single dictator or and party that will always be there (until they are overthrown-which they always are)..look at the Soviet Union). In a sense the U.S. gov cares about people just to the extent they are needed for the competing parties to stay in power. The current Chinese leader (Jinping) is somewhat of an empty suit. They may outlive Russia only bc when Putin is gone there may be some chaos.

I am gonna guess that the U.S. outlives them both.
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      01-02-2019, 02:33 AM   #143
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‘Sink two aircraft carriers’: Chinese Admiral’s recipe to dominate the South China Sea

https://www.news.com.au/technology/i...e28e791aa26e0f

Rear Admiral Lou Yuan is deputy head of the Chinese Academy of Military Sciences. In his speech, he said there were ‘five cornerstones of the United States’ open to exploitation: their military, their money, their talent, their voting system — and their fear of adversaries.
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      01-02-2019, 05:58 AM   #144
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eriphill View Post
‘Sink two aircraft carriers’: Chinese Admiral’s recipe to dominate the South China Sea

https://www.news.com.au/technology/i...e28e791aa26e0f

Rear Admiral Lou Yuan is deputy head of the Chinese Academy of Military Sciences. In his speech, he said there were ‘five cornerstones of the United States’ open to exploitation: their military, their money, their talent, their voting system — and their fear of adversaries.
Considering a super carrier is normally back up with 11 other ships, their brown water fleet and defective ballistic missiles are going to have a hell of a hard time sinking it.
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      01-02-2019, 07:24 AM   #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eriphill View Post
'Sink two aircraft carriers': Chinese Admiral's recipe to dominate the South China Sea

https://www.news.com.au/technology/i...e28e791aa26e0f

Rear Admiral Lou Yuan is deputy head of the Chinese Academy of Military Sciences. In his speech, he said there were 'five cornerstones of the United States' open to exploitation: their military, their money, their talent, their voting system — and their fear of adversaries.
Someone else had a similar idea. It resulted in Pearl Harbor. Didn't work out too well for the Japanese in the end.
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      01-02-2019, 07:26 AM   #146
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Xi Jinping says Taiwan 'must and will be' reunited with China http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-46733174

What he doesn't understand, is that the 20+ million people of Taiwan don't want to be communist Chinese.
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      01-02-2019, 11:52 AM   #147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eriphill View Post
'Sink two aircraft carriers': Chinese Admiral's recipe to dominate the South China Sea

https://www.news.com.au/technology/i...e28e791aa26e0f

Rear Admiral Lou Yuan is deputy head of the Chinese Academy of Military Sciences. In his speech, he said there were 'five cornerstones of the United States' open to exploitation: their military, their money, their talent, their voting system — and their fear of adversaries.
Someone else had a similar idea. It resulted in Pearl Harbor. Didn't work out too well for the Japanese in the end.
Sadly I can envision The Resistance embracing a US defeat if they thought President Trump would get blamed for it.
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      01-02-2019, 11:59 AM   #148
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Quote:
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Considering a super carrier is normally back up with 11 other ships, their brown water fleet and defective ballistic missiles are going to have a hell of a hard time sinking it.
There is no question the modern Chinese military possess the capability to carry out the threat, however I don't think the Chinese would be willing to pay the price for such an action.
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      01-02-2019, 12:06 PM   #149
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glennQNYC View Post
Sadly I can envision The Resistance embracing a US defeat if they thought President Trump would get blamed for it.
?

The resistance? Get real, Glenn.
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      01-02-2019, 12:07 PM   #150
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by glennQNYC View Post
Sadly I can envision The Resistance embracing a US defeat if they thought President Trump would get blamed for it.
?

The resistance? Get real, Glenn.
Using "Democrats" wasn't broad enough of a descriptor.
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      01-02-2019, 12:09 PM   #151
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Quote:
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Using "Democrats" wasn't broad enough of a descriptor.
You're still wrong. Painting with such a broad brush brings you no glory.
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      01-02-2019, 12:15 PM   #152
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by glennQNYC View Post
Using "Democrats" wasn't broad enough of a descriptor.
You're still wrong. Painting with such a broad brush brings you no glory.
Impossible. I can't be proven wrong until something happens that results in us seeing broad support for President Trump. Until then I stand by my prediction that too many people would rather embrace defeat than embrace our President.
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      01-02-2019, 02:19 PM   #153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
Someone else had a similar idea. It resulted in Pearl Harbor. Didn't work out too well for the Japanese in the end.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
Xi Jinping says Taiwan 'must and will be' reunited with China http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-46733174

What he doesn't understand, is that the 20+ million people of Taiwan don't want to be communist Chinese.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Refined View Post
There is no question the modern Chinese military possess the capability to carry out the threat, however I don't think the Chinese would be willing to pay the price for such an action.
I suspect that the price would be at the cost of their own regime.

Would the PLA at its current state be able to deal a bloody nose to the US?
Probably. But again, the cost, for Beijing, would be the legitimacy of the Chinese Communist Party, and ultimately, the regime itself.

Much of the West would immediately ostracize and sanction mainland China.
Remember, this whole economic tolerance (i.e., trading, investing, etc.) that the West has with China is profit driven, not ideological.
The government there merely tolerates diplomacy with the West (and vice-versa) but their ideological motives are completely at odds with each other, with China more in-line with Russia's view of the world.
The Pentagon recently called the two "Revisionist Powers", which, IMO is a very appropriate term.

So how did we get here?
I mean, not too long ago, mainland China was just another no-man's land aligned with the Eastern Bloc.
Well, it was really the product of a Realpolitik policy to deter the USSR (after the Sino-Soviet Split) under Kissinger's direction (and later nailed in the coffin by Nixon and Carter) at the expense of Taiwan and the Nationalist Chinese Government (with which the US had been allied with since WWII).

Eventually, it culminated in the Chinese manufacturing and economic boom that saw many Westerners and mainland Chinese alike, fatten their pockets.
Never did they know, that all along, the Chinese Communist government never had plans to "normalize" anything. Instead, the economic development was just a means for them to maintain power (under the guise of "stability, openness, and development") while communist regimes were falling all throughout Eastern Europe.
Of course, China was not immune to this wave of momentum, but on 4 June 1989, shocking news came from Beijing, the PLA had massacred protesters at Tiananmen.
The US & Western Europe (European Community, now EU) immediately placed an arms embargo on Beijing, which is still in affect to this day.

Okay, so what was the point of this long history lesson?
Well, in a nutshell, the brief (yet in depth) history of the West's relationship with the People's Republic of China is that of a reluctant tolerance.

Imagine a sales scenario: It would be kind of like that annoying customer/buyer who clearly is an asshole with no moral character, but shit...he's by far your largest account, so you kind of deal with it.
But the day he comes into your store/company/etc. and starts destroying your property, that's probably the day you stop doing business with him.
I suspect this would apply to China as well.
An arms embargo was placed on them for quelling a protest and killing their own citizens.
I'd imagine if the same type of violence was willingly inflicted on foreign citizens/US allies in conflict, then the consequences would be even more severe.
Sure, it's hard to ignore the mainland Chinese market, but if shit ever hits the fan, say goodbye to all the foreign investment and trade.

The only thing the Communist Party has going for them at this point is their economic track record (i.e., recent boom), which will most certainly not last forever.
The One Belt One Road initiative is their way of trying to gain rapport with Third World countries that have been more or less neglected by the West.
This is really the PRC's insurance policy. In the event of a conflict, the PRC can use this as leverage in the United Nations, as well as keep its own economy afloat after termination/suspension of trade with the West.

And lastly, there's combat experience, military capabilities, and geopolitical strategic factors.
I've mentioned earlier that I believe the PLA could deal quite a destructive blow (figuratively as a bloody nose) to the US, but that's a far cry from saying they'll be victorious in a war with the US.

For starters, it's important to explore the origins of the People's Liberation Army (PLA), which began as a peasant rebellion force (aka Chinese Red Army) that was often in conflict (Civil War) with the regular Chinese [Nationalist] Army at the time (formally National Revolutionary Army, later Republic of China Armed Forces).
Although the Chinese Red Army units engaged in occasional skirmishes during WWII against the invading Japanese, it was primarily the Nationalist troops that took the brunt of the fighting, and the "Chinese West Point" (Whampoa Military Academy) was a Nationalist Officer school that groomed some of the most hardcore, experienced, and patriotic men, often from privileged and educated backgrounds, lay their lives on the battlefield in the fight against Japan.
The PLA was able to capitalize on the fact that the Nationalist forces were significantly weakened by a decade-long conflict with Japan and, with Soviet aid (see Soviet invasion of Manchuria), laid the seeds that would see the defeat of the Nationalists and their retreat to Taiwan, where they remain to this day.
There was a lot of mutiny and desertion towards the waning years of the Chinese Civil War, which saw the PLA swell in numbers as it absorbed draftees formerly serving on the Nationalists side through a combination of coercion and false promises such as free land and other things familiar in socialist propaganda.
Most of the surviving experienced and competent generals and soldiers from the Second World War evacuated to Taiwan and continued to organize and train the Republic of China Armed Forces there to defend the last bastion of "Free China".

Anyhow, fast forward to the Korean War, and Communist China sent a "volunteer" force to aid North Korea against UN forces.
At the conflict's conclusion, up to two-thirds of the 21,800 "volunteers" willingly defected to Nationalist China (by now based on Formosa/Taiwan), which curiously suggests that many of these were forced conscripts of former Nationalist sympathizers simply sent to die in Korea.

And then, through the ensuing decades, the PLA saw border skirmishes with India and Vietnam, which saw PLA victory, but mostly resolved via status quo ante bellum.

The point of this walkthrough is to outline the lack of any real combat experience of the PLA.
From WWII to the Korean War to the border conflicts, all of the engagements that the PLA engaged in were minor roles.
The Chinese Communist Party likes to overemphasize its role in WWII when really, it was mostly a guerrilla force that launched surprise ambushes from time to time.
Similar story with the Korean War, where it was an ambush attack that was accomplished with sheer numbers rather than any strategic coordination.

Capabilities-wise, the PLA is not even close to that of the US, plain and simple.
Their only aircraft carrier is a hand-me-down Soviet era vessel purchased from the Ukraine and much of their air force is built off of Soviet platforms or reverse engineered.
They have no experience in amphibious combat or amphibious landings, nor do they have any real naval or air combat experience.
What they do have is size & numbers, which would have been more important 100 years ago, but technology is what wins wars now, which is why Beijing has been revamping and investing heavily in military technological advancement and is also partially the motive behind the stealing of confidential information, as well as intellectual property.

And finally, the geopolitical strategic factors.
By far, the US has the upper hand here.
I mentioned this in another post, but there is something called the First Island Chain and second island chain, which, when analyzed strategically, really looks like a "wall" that contains/constricts mainland China.
It's been a thorn on the side for Beijing for many years.
Looking at the map, it makes complete sense why they are so urgently trying to assert dominance over both Taiwan and the South China Sea, dominance of either of which would provide an opening in the First Island Chain.


Even so, the US commands near-exclusive military mandate over the region, with significant military presence (i.e., bases all over Japan, Guam, S. Korea, etc.) and a naval strike group that can respond to any threat (Seventh Fleet), which has been deployed on many occasions in the past.

In an all-out war, the PLA may be able to take out some bases, perhaps decimate Taiwan's infrastructure, and weaken the Seventh Fleet, but an amphibious landing on Taiwan would be a logistical nightmare, where the PLA would still be met with resistance from the Republic of China Armed Forces, which has trained for this scenario for decades.
On the Korean Peninsula and Japan, THAAD systems and the well equipped Republic of Korea Armed Forces and Japanese Self-Defense Forces would still be able to hold off any advance.
Ultimately the idea is that the aforementioned defense forces would be able to hold off PLA incursions and advances until US backup arrives.
By then, the US would just be getting started and while the PLA would've caused a lot of destruction to stationed US forces and its allies, it would've already exhausted much of its capabilities.


Of course, it's fun and intellectual to speculate, but talk is cheap and the Chinese Communists probably know that even though they like to talk big, an all-out conflict with the United States would only spell the death of their own regime.
The same can be said of North Korea.
In either case, we can only hope such a conflict never happens.
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      01-02-2019, 02:23 PM   #154
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I hope there isn't a test after this
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