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      01-12-2023, 01:03 PM   #1
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Dash Brake warning light

I'm trying to track down the source of this dash brake warning light.
The photo is with the ignition on but engine not running, when the engine starts all the other warnings disappear and the brake light stays on, solid red, no blinking.
I just refreshed the whole braking system, with overhauled brake calipers, new pads, new flex hoses, fresh Motul 600 fluid.
No air is in the system, I've taken the car for a couple of mile drive and the brakes working perfectly.
I didn't replace the pad wear sensors, I should have but I have placed an order them now.
Any ideas?
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      01-12-2023, 01:14 PM   #2
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Parking Brake?

Brake warning light reset? Never heard of this.

https://zroadster.org/threads/bmw-br...ght-reset.177/
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      01-12-2023, 01:35 PM   #3
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Did you replace the discs too? Did you replace parking brake shoes and/or adjust them? Is your parking brake switch faulty or one notch engaged?
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      01-12-2023, 03:04 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeler View Post
Parking Brake?

Brake warning light reset? Never heard of this.

https://zroadster.org/threads/bmw-br...ght-reset.177/
I'll give that a try tomorrow and if it doesn't work, I'll try it again when the new pad sensors arrive, although I can't see how the system could tell the difference between new and old sensors unless of the continuity was broken.
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Originally Posted by mmm-five View Post
Did you replace the discs too? Did you replace parking brake shoes and/or adjust them? Is your parking brake switch faulty or one notch engaged?
Front discs were replaced, the rear discs had lot of meat on them and pretty flat so reused. Original parking brake shoes and hardware were in condition so clean and reinstalled.
Parking brake switch,hmmm I'll have to check but isn't there a warning light just for the hand brake?
Thanks guys
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      01-12-2023, 05:36 PM   #5
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Connect up ista+ or inpa to see what it's complaining about.
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      01-13-2023, 11:53 AM   #6
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Manual isn't much help, although it does show a distinct warning light for pad wear.
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      01-19-2023, 05:54 PM   #7
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Hi Grannyknot,

Definitely post once you get new sensors installed.

I don't know the answer, but I can share what I found out on my former 2008 128i convertible - those cars have 2-stage sensors, and a body computer reset after the first stage of the sensor has triggered gives a 'permanent' error light until the situation is remedied.

It would be nice to know whether the E85/E86 sensors are 1-stage like E46 chassis, or 2-stage like the 1-series. I checked RealOEM, and the part numbers for the sensors on the both M and non-M E85/E86 chassis are the same, but they are not shared with other BMW's, so that didn't tell me much.
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      01-19-2023, 08:12 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarinerZ4C View Post
Hi Grannyknot,

Definitely post once you get new sensors installed.

I don't know the answer, but I can share what I found out on my former 2008 128i convertible - those cars have 2-stage sensors, and a body computer reset after the first stage of the sensor has triggered gives a 'permanent' error light until the situation is remedied.

It would be nice to know whether the E85/E86 sensors are 1-stage like E46 chassis, or 2-stage like the 1-series. I checked RealOEM, and the part numbers for the sensors on the both M and non-M E85/E86 chassis are the same, but they are not shared with other BMW's, so that didn't tell me much.
I know that the Z4M at least has it's pad wear sensors in series so if one sensor notices a worn pad you have to check and remedy the fault before you can clear the warning light, makes you check all 4 corners which I guess is a good idea.
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      01-19-2023, 09:15 PM   #9
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The Z4M only has one brake pad wear sensor per axle

Front left and rear right

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      01-19-2023, 09:17 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grannyknot View Post
I know that the Z4M at least has it's pad wear sensors in series so if one sensor notices a worn pad you have to check and remedy the fault before you can clear the warning light, makes you check all 4 corners which I guess is a good idea.
You have 4 sensors on your Z4M?
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      01-20-2023, 07:40 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XMetal View Post
You have 4 sensors on your Z4M?
No, badly worded.
I say check all four corners because when you get a pad wear warning on the dash it doesn't tell you if it is the front or back and then only tells you that the worn pad could be the inner front right or the inner rear left.
So one way or the other you'll have to check all the pads to be safe and get rid of the warning light.
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      01-26-2023, 02:07 PM   #12
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So the hand brake switch was part of the problem, I didn't pay close enough attention when replacing the hand brake with a good used one a few months back.
Now I turn the key to the second position, the brake light shows in red, then turns amber, then disappears all together, then turns amber again and stays that way whether the key is in the second position or the with the engine running.

The pad wear sensors came in today so will have those installed tomorrow and I'll see if that does the trick.
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      01-27-2023, 02:24 PM   #13
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The new pad sensors are in and no change to the amber brake light but now the yellow DSC triangle is showing on the tach, DSC button doesn't light up at all when pushed and doesn't turn off the amber triangle.

I'm also getting a 5E40 steering angle sensor plausibility code.
When I open up the Steering Angle Sensor window I see,

code 10410009 no description
OB sensor/vehicle allocation incorrect
code 10410010 no description

I opened the data stream for the steering angle and it is reading 45-50 degrees off.
I've gone through with the engine running and turning the wheel lock to lock hoping that would reset it but no luck.
I'm think the amber brake light is related to the DSC code because brakes are part of the DSC.
So it looks like resetting the steering angle is the first order and that may take care of the rest.
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      01-27-2023, 10:11 PM   #14
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I think INPA can recalibrate the steering angle sensor. If not try ISTA+.
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      01-28-2023, 07:59 AM   #15
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Dumb suggestion... have you tried disconnecting the battery and let it sit for an hour or so?
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      01-28-2023, 08:28 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
Dumb suggestion... have you tried disconnecting the battery and let it sit for an hour or so?
I haven't for this current problem but I have had the battery disconnected and reconnected multiple times over the last 5 months while rebuilding the car, I'll give it a go just the same.
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      01-28-2023, 09:09 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarinerZ4C View Post
Hi Grannyknot,

Definitely post once you get new sensors installed.

I don't know the answer, but I can share what I found out on my former 2008 128i convertible - those cars have 2-stage sensors, and a body computer reset after the first stage of the sensor has triggered gives a 'permanent' error light until the situation is remedied.

It would be nice to know whether the E85/E86 sensors are 1-stage like E46 chassis, or 2-stage like the 1-series. I checked RealOEM, and the part numbers for the sensors on the both M and non-M E85/E86 chassis are the same, but they are not shared with other BMW's, so that didn't tell me much.
Thay are single stage. Dual stage are used in BMWs that have a full CBS system that estimates brake pad wear mileage. The E46 electrical architecture does not have that feature. The E90 platform introduced the new CBS electrical architecture to the 3-Series.
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      01-28-2023, 09:19 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grannyknot View Post
I haven't for this current problem but I have had the battery disconnected and reconnected multiple times over the last 5 months while rebuilding the car, I'll give it a go just the same.
I figure it can't hurt. I'm pretty well familiar with BMWs brake wear systems since I've had them on all 5 of my BMWs since back to the 1989 E30 and done at least 15 brake jobs since then. It pretty simple, the wear indicator breaks circuit once the pad wears it out and a new sensor turns off the light. I thought replacing the sensors would fix it for you, which is why I've not weighed in until today. I've replaced the brakes in my Coupe just once and IIRC the scan told me what axle it was*.

My only other thoughts are the brake fulid level sensor is bad, or a mouse nawed on one of the pad sensor harness between the body and connector. You might need to pull the left rear and right front wheelwell liners to check.

The dual-stage system like in the E90 can get all cattywampus if you don't replace the sensors before you reset the CBS, but the E86 doesn't have that type of system.

* Edit.

I just checked my E86 service records. It turns out I replaced all four brakes at the same time, but the rears were down to the nubs. In my service notes I wrote, "At first drive to bed pads, the pad wear light did not reset. After ignition off and restart, the icon went off and has stayed off." I remember that was unusual since I had never experienced that before.

So dumb question #2, have you driven the car since you replaced the sensors?
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Last edited by Efthreeoh; 01-28-2023 at 09:27 AM..
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      01-29-2023, 03:14 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
I figure it can't hurt. I'm pretty well familiar with BMWs brake wear systems since I've had them on all 5 of my BMWs since back to the 1989 E30 and done at least 15 brake jobs since then. It pretty simple, the wear indicator breaks circuit once the pad wears it out and a new sensor turns off the light. I thought replacing the sensors would fix it for you, which is why I've not weighed in until today. I've replaced the brakes in my Coupe just once and IIRC the scan told me what axle it was*.

My only other thoughts are the brake fulid level sensor is bad, or a mouse nawed on one of the pad sensor harness between the body and connector. You might need to pull the left rear and right front wheelwell liners to check.

The dual-stage system like in the E90 can get all cattywampus if you don't replace the sensors before you reset the CBS, but the E86 doesn't have that type of system.

* Edit.

I just checked my E86 service records. It turns out I replaced all four brakes at the same time, but the rears were down to the nubs. In my service notes I wrote, "At first drive to bed pads, the pad wear light did not reset. After ignition off and restart, the icon went off and has stayed off." I remember that was unusual since I had never experienced that before.

So dumb question #2, have you driven the car since you replaced the sensors?
Thanks, I have had the wheel well liners off and everything looked good, no signs of mice activity.

I would love to take the car out for a drive but I have a foot of snow in front of the garage so it won't be anytime soon.

I disconnected the battery last night and also pulled the plug on the brake fluid level sensor.
Connected the battery this morning and turned the ignition to ON, the brake light was a constant red, then plugged in the brake fluid level sensor and the brake light went back to amber, so that looks to me like the fluid level sensor is working.
I still think it is connect to the DSC in some way, that's what I'm going to focus on for now.
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      02-04-2023, 10:35 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grannyknot View Post
Thanks, I have had the wheel well liners off and everything looked good, no signs of mice activity.

I would love to take the car out for a drive but I have a foot of snow in front of the garage so it won't be anytime soon.

I disconnected the battery last night and also pulled the plug on the brake fluid level sensor.
Connected the battery this morning and turned the ignition to ON, the brake light was a constant red, then plugged in the brake fluid level sensor and the brake light went back to amber, so that looks to me like the fluid level sensor is working.
I still think it is connect to the DSC in some way, that's what I'm going to focus on for now.
Maybe the brake system needs to get wheel speed sensor input before it will reset. I'd suggest throwing it up on sands to run through the gears to get the wheels spinning, but the fronts probably need to rotate as well. I just think you need to drive it...
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      02-04-2023, 01:37 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
Maybe the brake system needs to get wheel speed sensor input before it will reset. I'd suggest throwing it up on sands to run through the gears to get the wheels spinning, but the fronts probably need to rotate as well. I just think you need to drive it...
Well I have an answer for you in 2 months
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      02-04-2023, 02:40 PM   #22
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I want to say that this happened to me, because the rear wheels were turning and the fronts were not. But I can't say with 100% certainty.
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