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      01-06-2014, 11:00 AM   #89
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A quick tip for those who will purchase this kit:

1. The rear two piece lines for the MZ4 Coupe comes with a choice of an angled banjo adapter and a straight banjo adapter. Use the angled one. I am going to make a suggestion to RB to just include the angled one.

2. To facilitate the rear caliper install, loosely attach the angled banjo adapter to the line with the swivel fitting, loosely attach the banjo adapter with the copper washers to the mounted caliper, then do your magic with attaching the line to the bracket, then the 2nd line to the bracket AND the chassis fitting. Tighten the swivel fitting by hand with an 11mm wrench, do not over-tighten. Then tighten the banjo fitting to 15 ft-lbs.

3. For an OEM like fit using the factory mounting bracket, which is recommended by ME because this will prevent the line from coming into contact with various moving parts in the rear, you should follow the steps above. If you choose not to use the factory mounting, you can attach the two lines together ahead of time, and zip tie the lines to the rear trailing arm. This method will make sure there's minimum fluid loss and prevent air from entering and getting trapped in places you don't want it getting trapped.

Got the full front and rear kit installed over the weekend, haven't had a chance to go bed in the brakes due to a long list of "honey dos." And I mean LONG list. Managed to squeeze in the caliper install when wife and kid are in church which in itself is a huge accomplishment, if you ask me.

Install went without a hitch. About as straight forward as you can imagine, except for the funky design of the rear brake line on the MZ4 Coupe. I think the MZ4 and the MZ3 are the only BMWs that I've ever seen with this weird 2 piece rear brake line, and on the MZ4 it's bolted to a bracket first, then a compound hard line/rubber line to the fitting on the chassis side. RacingBrake took extra care in providing an MZ4 specific rear brake line with two choices for banjo fitting, one straight and one angled. The angled fitting works much better to clear all the components in the rear and make sure nothing rubs as the suspension moves up and down. But due to the two piece line being bolted to the bracket, I had to basically work blind to thread the 2nd line on while the system is open, and on the rear driver's side it took much longer than necessary and it made a sizable mess with brake fluid everywhere.

The rear caliper was so light, that it wouldn't trigger the digital bathroom scale I was using. I ended up having to put on a heavy box first, measure it, then put the caliper assembly in. The factory caliper, pads, carrier, and lines weigh a total of 8.8 lbs. The box and the RB rear caliper, pads, carrier and lines weight 14.2 lbs, and the box itself weighed 7.4 lbs, so that makes the entire RB rear assembly 6.8 lbs. 2 full lbs lighter than the OE caliper. Pretty impressive. So if you're doing strictly the caliper upgrade along, the full kit saves a total of 8 lbs up front, 4 lbs in the rear for a total of 12 lbs of unsprung mass.

Due to the extended time the line was cracked open when I was having trouble threading on the second line, I suspect some air may have gotten into the ABS unit. I'm going to see if my friendly mechanic has time this weekend to cycle the pump just for sh*ts and giggles, and re-bleed that corner again. Then I'll go fully bed in the pads. Otherwise it wouldn't be entirely fair to give an assessment from moving the car around in the driveway. But based on the few quick pumps of the pedal while moving the car, I have to say, I'm impressed. The pedal is rock freakin' solid with a very direct feel, without any of that 1/4" of dead travel the OEM system has always had since new. We'll see how it behaves with the slotted RB rotors, with the flex/float design of the OEM caliper there's always a vibration in the pedal upon heavy brake application on track. I suspect the fixed caliper design will go a long way to alleviate.

I have to say, I'm very impressed with the amount of hardware they provided for the rear. Typically for these sort of kits, most won't even bother with the compound line, and just provide you with a long braided brake line and expect the experts installing the kit to zip tie it where and when appropriate. My experience with this car though, since the rear line is tied to the rear trailing arm, when the trailing arm moves, the line flexes and moves and MAY come in contact with the rear tire, especially if you're running super wide tires. When I used to run a stainless steel braided line on the MZ4 Coupe, I noticed one of the rear lines were slowly being worn away...In long, fast, and heavy sweepers the tires deflect far enough and the brake line moved enough to come in contact with the tire. I suspect that is why BMW provided a hard, rigid line as part of the rear brake hydraulics, so there's zero chance of anything flexing out far enough to come in contact with a wider than factory tire (275 wide).

They (RB) certainly went above and beyond to make sure it fit our cars properly. This kit probably could have been released 6-8 months ago but they kept making minor changes to make sure they FIT. I have to applaud RB for that.
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      01-06-2014, 11:22 AM   #90
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for those out there considering the rears as an upgrade to OE... the RB rear caliper kit *will not* work with the OE rotors. they are designed only for the RB rear rotors which are 2mm thicker. ask me how annoyed i am about them telling me they would work before they were available, and me purchasing/installing the fronts already. it may have been a miscommunication... ? idk.

the build quality is fantastic though! A+ to RB for that.
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      01-06-2014, 11:55 AM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by v3.2mc View Post
for those out there considering the rears as an upgrade to OE... the RB rear caliper kit *will not* work with the OE rotors. they are designed only for the RB rear rotors which are 2mm thicker. ask me how annoyed i am about them telling me they would work before they were available, and me purchasing/installing the fronts already. it may have been a miscommunication... ? idk.

the build quality is fantastic though! A+ to RB for that.
They will work if you can slip a couple of ~1mm thick titanium or aluminum backing plates behind the pads. It wouldn't be difficult to source the titanium backing plates because the pad shape is the same as the rear pads on Mitsu EVOs with Brembo calipers.

They don't recommend using the kit because they can't be sure that everyone will follow the recommendation, and straight out of the box, technically, they don't work. Plus, ideally they'd like to sell you their rear rotor as well for a true performance upgrade.

But I have confirmed. It is possible with backing plates.
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      01-06-2014, 12:07 PM   #92
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like so?

if this works, i'm buying you a beer!
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      01-06-2014, 01:52 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by v3.2mc View Post
like so?

if this works, i'm buying you a beer!
Yes. The concern with the RB kit on OE rotor is that when fully extended on a set of worn rotors, the caliper pistons MAY move past the seal since the OE rotors are 2mm thinner than the RB rotors. So if you have a couple of backing plates taking up that 2mm margin, then it will be within the margins.

For any manufacturer, there's too much liability to recommend or say a product fits if you need to add or modify something like a shim to make it work 100%. I think that's why they put in that language about it not working with OEM rotors.

Those titanium shims also give you an added bonus of shielding heat from transferring to the piston and thus the fluids in the calipers, although I was told the stainless steel caliper pistons already do a much better job at insulating the fluid than OE calipers or aluminum pistons.
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      01-06-2014, 02:00 PM   #94
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I just took a quick peek, and the PN you've listed is for the front brake pad on EVO X. The rear brake pads are FMSI D1368. You need to find shims that match that same FMSI number.
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      01-06-2014, 02:09 PM   #95
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thank you for catching that!

here is the rear set.
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      01-20-2014, 10:11 AM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The HACK View Post
I just took a quick peek, and the PN you've listed is for the front brake pad on EVO X. The rear brake pads are FMSI D1368. You need to find shims that match that same FMSI number.
How's that big brake kit working for ya ?
got a few sudden stops already ?
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      01-20-2014, 10:27 AM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tikamak View Post
How's that big brake kit working for ya ?
got a few sudden stops already ?
Out of necessity I've been driving the MZ4 Coupe the last 3 days (the Hyundai is in the "shop") and will be driving the MZ4 Coupe for the next 3 day most likely...So far so good, brake pedal feel is firm and consistent, which is one of the biggest benefit the kit addresses. Kit is riding on ET300 pads right now, but for street driving the braking power is firm and fairly linear. Haven't accumulated enough miles to see significant dust.

I am hearing some light squeal from the pads towards the last few feet of stop, so I might take the wheels off this weekend and inspect and make sure I had the anti-rattling clip installed correctly, and see if there's an opportunity to go bed in the brakes again. The rotor surface is still mostly coated with the track pads from the last time I used it. I expect the squealing to go away in a few weeks of regular driving or after the next bedding.
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      01-20-2014, 11:02 AM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The HACK View Post
Out of necessity I've been driving the MZ4 Coupe the last 3 days (the Hyundai is in the "shop") and will be driving the MZ4 Coupe for the next 3 day most likely...So far so good, brake pedal feel is firm and consistent, which is one of the biggest benefit the kit addresses. Kit is riding on ET300 pads right now, but for street driving the braking power is firm and fairly linear. Haven't accumulated enough miles to see significant dust.

I am hearing some light squeal from the pads towards the last few feet of stop, so I might take the wheels off this weekend and inspect and make sure I had the anti-rattling clip installed correctly, and see if there's an opportunity to go bed in the brakes again. The rotor surface is still mostly coated with the track pads from the last time I used it. I expect the squealing to go away in a few weeks of regular driving or after the next bedding.
Pretty nice.
I have a Kia Picanto as a daily beater like you since my car is supercharged with some recaro pole positions and a very aggressive tune. the car bites everyone's face off. i might have some additional power because i feel like i have some boost leaks.

Can't wait to get some brake upgrades. i feel like i'm not able to drive the car to its fullest as well as not driving it a lot.


Lemme know when stuff happens with your brakes, you have been a great reviewer so far.
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      01-20-2014, 01:44 PM   #99
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HACK if you dont mind me asking, if you could do it all over again would you still pick the RB kit rather than Brembo, or even the PF kit?

Also if you do have time, since i know you are always busy, what is your opinion on rotor size? What i mean to ask is, the PF front kit comes in one of two sizes, 323 and i believe 355, but i could be a tad off... Do you think a z4m coupe could greatly benefit from a 355 vs a 323 rotor?
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      01-20-2014, 03:32 PM   #100
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I think it's going to be personal preference and cost/performance benefit, and it'll be different for everyone.

For me, it's a no brainer. I've already got RB rotors, the RB caliper kit allows me to install fixed calipers without having to ditch my RB rotors and reinvest in additional hardware for additional cost. RB being one of the first to market with a replaceable 2 piece front rotor, and now a rear rotor that does not eliminate the parking brake functionality means it was a no brainer for me too to keep the entire system RB.

I have explored PFC's caliper kit, which would require a new caliper bracket machined for the front. I have also explored Wilwood's ultralite calipers since I can source those relatively cheap. But at the end of the day, the work and machining that's required to build custom brackets to make it work, and the hoops I'd have to jump through to source the additional hardware makes it not feasible.

I even contacted a BMW vendor that carries AP racing kits designed for the E36 M3, and could have had him make a set of custom carriers, but again...Why go through the hoops when RB was perfectly capable of making a set of calipers that are just as feature rich, and I've already got their parts on my car?

For me, I was able to retain my 18" rim setup without having to run spacers (now that I'm exploring using rear rims with the ET30 offset up front, I wouldn't need to run 5mm spacers for track...For street setup I will still need it), without having to pay more for rotors and caliper kit (in actuality I already paid for the rotors would be the REAL rationale), so unless Brembo, AP, Wilwood, StopTECH, or any of the other vendors offer such a set-up as allowing me to run what I got with minimum expenditures, then there's little choice for me.

Besides, given the amount of time, work, and research RacingBrake already threw into making a kit that works for OUR car? I mean, even if they managed to sell 1 kit for every 100 car sold in North America, it still only amounts to 17 kits TOTAL. Granted the E46 M3 uses the same exact set-up...
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      01-20-2014, 03:39 PM   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dorifto88 View Post
Also if you do have time, since i know you are always busy, what is your opinion on rotor size? What i mean to ask is, the PF front kit comes in one of two sizes, 323 and i believe 355, but i could be a tad off... Do you think a z4m coupe could greatly benefit from a 355 vs a 323 rotor?
The 323mm kit would be a down-size in rotor and change the bias significantly. The 355mm would be larger than the 345mm from OE. Depending on your wheel availability and needs, it could be the difference from having to shell out an additional $2,000 to get wheels and tires that fit (and that's a gross understatement), or having to run 10-12mm spacers to allow for either barrel clearance or spoke clearance.

However, if you've got a set of wheels that are BBK friendly already (say, BBS CH or BBS CH-R, or Apex ARC-8 or EC-7), the 355mm kit would probably be a very nice fit and compliment to the chassis. It's the same deal, if you've already made the wheel/tire investment that makes it easier to shop for BBKs, then it's really just about getting what you would prefer personally.
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      01-22-2014, 12:23 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The HACK
Quote:
Originally Posted by dorifto88 View Post
Also if you do have time, since i know you are always busy, what is your opinion on rotor size? What i mean to ask is, the PF front kit comes in one of two sizes, 323 and i believe 355, but i could be a tad off... Do you think a z4m coupe could greatly benefit from a 355 vs a 323 rotor?
The 323mm kit would be a down-size in rotor and change the bias significantly. The 355mm would be larger than the 345mm from OE. Depending on your wheel availability and needs, it could be the difference from having to shell out an additional $2,000 to get wheels and tires that fit (and that's a gross understatement), or having to run 10-12mm spacers to allow for either barrel clearance or spoke clearance.

However, if you've got a set of wheels that are BBK friendly already (say, BBS CH or BBS CH-R, or Apex ARC-8 or EC-7), the 355mm kit would probably be a very nice fit and compliment to the chassis. It's the same deal, if you've already made the wheel/tire investment that makes it easier to shop for BBKs, then it's really just about getting what you would prefer personally.
You definitely want the 355mm on track it is epic , with PFC 08 pads I'm seeing 1.2-1.3 braking G's all day long with perfect modulation . I have the PFC kit , pricey but top notch , it's real race level equipment . 10k track miles on my front calipers and still going strong . The bigger rotor is key to managing the heat of using a race pad in my humble opinion .
George
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      03-17-2014, 05:04 AM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The HACK View Post
The 323mm kit would be a down-size in rotor and change the bias significantly. The 355mm would be larger than the 345mm from OE. Depending on your wheel availability and needs, it could be the difference from having to shell out an additional $2,000 to get wheels and tires that fit (and that's a gross understatement), or having to run 10-12mm spacers to allow for either barrel clearance or spoke clearance.

However, if you've got a set of wheels that are BBK friendly already (say, BBS CH or BBS CH-R, or Apex ARC-8 or EC-7), the 355mm kit would probably be a very nice fit and compliment to the chassis. It's the same deal, if you've already made the wheel/tire investment that makes it easier to shop for BBKs, then it's really just about getting what you would prefer personally.
Any track sessions mate?
How's the kit working for you ?

I am currently looking at this insane group buy:
http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=469943

10% off all PFC BBKs and rotors
25% off pads
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      03-17-2014, 12:56 PM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tikamak View Post
Any track sessions mate?
How's the kit working for you ?

I am currently looking at this insane group buy:
http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=469943

10% off all PFC BBKs and rotors
25% off pads
I really, really want a setup from PF...
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      03-17-2014, 03:22 PM   #105
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Originally Posted by nekky View Post
I really, really want a setup from PF...
You can join the group buy, even if only for pads for now
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      03-17-2014, 05:36 PM   #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tikamak View Post
You can join the group buy, even if only for pads for now
See bro, that's the problem: I don't really *need* anything perse... have many other things I should buy first! But I know I "need" a BBK eventually once my car is good to go Been almost 6 months since I've driven it...
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      03-18-2014, 12:02 AM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nekky View Post
See bro, that's the problem: I don't really *need* anything perse... have many other things I should buy first! But I know I "need" a BBK eventually once my car is good to go Been almost 6 months since I've driven it...
You can get some stock application zrated pads that would run you about 150$

2 months from now you can sell them for 200$ easy if you didnt use them.

I mean 25% off, we gotta benefit from that. Im buying 3-4 sets.
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      03-18-2014, 02:18 PM   #108
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I'm going to Chuckwalla in 2 weeks with a new setup, squared 275mm Maxxis RC-1 R-comps with new RB XR-70 track pads. Will report back after.
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      03-19-2014, 07:38 AM   #109
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I'm going to Chuckwalla in 2 weeks with a new setup, squared 275mm Maxxis RC-1 R-comps with new RB XR-70 track pads. Will report back after.
I'm extremely confused between PFC and racingbrake BBKs.

I can source the full big brake kit with 323mmx32m front rotor PFC for about the same cost as the racingbrake full BBK due to this GB:
http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=469943

What do you think should I choose and why ?
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      03-19-2014, 08:59 AM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tikamak View Post
I'm extremely confused between PFC and racingbrake BBKs.

What do you think should I choose and why ?
There are little differences once you go the fixed caliper route. The simple determination should be "what's the kit with the biggest, best rotor with the easiest install that will fit my existing hardware with the best price."

Find a kit that meets most criteria above. If you're racing the car heavily, add "which caliper kit has the racing compound I use and what other race specific caliper features does it have, like billet construction, stainless steel pistons, additional stiffening bridge...etc."

I'm not going to make YOUR decision for you. You already know which kit I have on the car.
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