Wearing suit for the first time, need help is this too loose?

[P1]

Mate, honest question, but why did no one assist you at the shop where you bought this suit? Did no one fit you or measure you? Or did you just walk in, pick up a random suit in your size, pay for it and roll home?

By the way, I always enjoy these threads. When guys at a car forum start talking about dressing well, I always get my popcorn out.

[tony20009]

Stand straight in a 3-way mirror and look at the back of the suit jacket while wearing it.

• If you see vertical drapes (something roughly akin to drapes in a curtain) down the main area of your back, the jacket is too loose/big.
• If you see horizontal furrowing between your shoulders, the jacket is too tight/small.

What do very well fitting suits look like?
The photo below illustrates what an almost perfectly fitted suit looks like. The shoulder on the right side of the photo appears to have a slight imperfection, but that could be the result of construction rather than fitting. I would prefer a tiny bit less of a "dimple" at the button closure, but there's not much one can do about it if the button hole has been cut prior to one's buying the suit and the rest of the midsection and chest of the coat fits correctly. Be that as it may, the suit below does indeed fit the model quite well, even though it's not perfect in every detail.



I suspect the pic above and my comments have made you wonder what a better tailored than the suit above looks like. Well, Cary Grant's suit in the photo below nearly appears to be bespoke (100% custom made for him). It may actually be a bespoke suit, but I can't be sure because I don't know whether the angle at which he's holding his bent arm is a natural one or staged that way for the sake of filming or promotional photography. With a suit having armholes cut a bit higher, I could say for sure. (How high or low an armhole is cut is endemic to a suit's style, not its cut or fit.)





Below are some young guys who also are wearing extremely well fitted/tailored, slim cut suits. Your goal is to get a suit -- whatever the cut -- and have it, after alterations, fit like that (within the constraints of the suit's basic cut), or as close as you can come to it. Now, I could tell the instant I saw the photo that they are wearing bespoke suits. That's what "looking like a million bucks" in a contemporary, slim cut suit looks like with regard to suit fit. (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/ar...cial-suit.html) I doubt most folks would know those are custom made suits, but I suspect everyone can tell that they fit very well even if they don't know why.

You'll notice that even though the models' aren't standing straight and stiff as a board, their suits show little or no puckering, pulling, etc. Remember what I wrote about the button hole "dimple" and the first suit above? Now look at the button hole of the guy on the far right; there's no sign of a button "dimple" at all. Also, for now, make note of where his lapel roll begins relative to the top button on his jacket. I'll discuss that again later.


(The guy with the big hair either missed a fitting, gained some weight, or is standing with his legs a bit farther apart than is "normal," which is what I suspect is the case. His pants are a tiny bit tight in the crotch.)

Below is a group of guys who also are wearing perfectly (or nearly so, again these are photos from a film, so it's hard to be sure) fitted suits and one fellow wearing a near perfectly fitted suit.

Photo from the movie Rope - The relevant characters for the discussion below are (moving right from the older gent in the middle):

• Mr. Kentley (acted by Sir Cedric Hardwicke)
• Brandon (John Dall)
• Phillip (Farley Granger)
• Rupert Cadell (James Stewart)

You might notice the extra billow of material in Phillip's jacket shoulder/sleeve. That is either a construction imperfection or a deliberate styling element; I don't know which. You might also notice the "dimpling" around Mr. Kentley's shoulder. That is definitely a construction flaw.

A few words about trouser break:
Another thing you'll notice in the first photo above from Rope is a range of trouser "breaks." There's no "right" break and which one a guy chooses depends on two things: (1) the amount of material available and (2) the guy's personal style.

Here's what I choose, but that's not say you should or need to do the same. I tend to opt for a very modest break on business suits and a fuller break on casual suits. With formal wear I expect to wear and dance in too, I prefer a full break because the added motion makes me look better dancing, but if I'm mainly going to do the "S&M thing" (stand and model) in my tux, I prefer little to no break because the unbroken line from head-to-toe looks more elegant. So what's the solution? Buy two pairs of pants when buying formal wear. (I recommend doing so with nearly every suit one might buy, but with off the rack (OTR) suits, it's not often an option. I recommend two pairs of pants with suits because pants are what will wear out first, assuming a guy is able to maintain his shape for a long time and the suit in question isn't likely to go out of style.)

In the next photo from Rope, you'll see the guy in the very dressy dark suit has almost no break in his trousers. Compare how the look of his suit and the one Farley Granger wears with the less dressy ones worn by the older guy in the center of the photo and Jimmy Stewart's in the earlier photo from that movie and you should be able to tell what I was talking about re: trouser "break."



Sidebar: some thoughts about Mr. Kentley's suit fit:
Looking at the suits on the fellows in black and white photos, I'm almost certain that the less-than-perfect fit and construction of the older fellow's suit is deliberate.

Why? Along with the shoddy construction of the shoulder, the uncharacteristically heavy break in his trousers (though not the dressiest of suits, it's still a "business" suit not a "casual" suit as is Jimmy Stewart's) the roll of his lapel isn't correct. The lapel roll begins too far down and is a bit pressed down, making it lack the luxurious fullness and flow that is very readily seen in Farley Granger's or Cary Grant's lapels. Also, if one watches the movie, it's all but impossible to notice that the Character of Phillip and Brandon are portrayed as being young, independently wealthy and fashionable whereas the older fellow, Mr. Kentley is something like a banker or accountant, very well off, but still a working man for whom joie de vivre doesn't necessarily include being among the nattiest fellows in the room.
End of sidebar.

On to the heart of your inquiry:
There are more than a few websites that show one how a suit should look, but IMO, few of them tell you what you need to know to make sure your suit is tailored to make you "look like a million bucks" no matter how much you spent on the suit. Even worse, I couldn't find one that shows what the back of a suit is supposed to look like on a perfectly fitted suit jacket, or what correctly fitted trousers should look like from behind. (That may be something they avoid discussing in deference to the men's clothing industry which would just as soon men not know lest they complain about "too close together pockets, awkwardly spaced belt loops, darts, and strangely angled seams and cloth sections in jackets.) Here are a few that go the extra mile and address the finer points that really make a difference that isn't readily obvious but that makes the difference between a "good fit" and what appears to be a perfect, bespoke fit.

• http://www.gq.com/gallery/suits-guide-tailoring-fit
• The one site I found that had photos of what a "too tight" suit looks like from behind: http://articlesofstyle.com/36988/mad...pel-indochino/
  
  I strongly suggest checking out this site even though you don't seem to be considering a MTM suit. The variety of suit fits and cuts and how they affect the starting point in the alterations process, along with the corresponding discussion should, prove helpful.
  
  Below is the too tight suit. The lighting in the other photos doesn't seem good enough to tell if they fit right or not. Here's what a too-tight suit looks like from behind. Notice the horizontal shoulder level furrows. They indicate that the jacket is too tight in the shoulders. Notice also the "dimple" at the top of his shoulder as viewed from the side. That "dimple" indicates that the guy's shoulder extends beyond the shoulder of the suit's main body. The rest of suit appears to be a reasonable fit otherwise.
  
  Tailors will let out the center seam to abate the tightness across the shoulders, but my advice is to try the next size up and consult with the tailor about whether the better approach is to take in the larger jacket or let out the smaller one. There's quite simply nothing a tailor can do to correct for one's shoulder extending beyond the shoulder portion of the suit's main body. When the main suit body shoulder section is too wide for the man wearing the suit, a tailor can cut it down. When that same part of the suit is not wide enough, the tailor cannot add material to make it wider.
  
  If I were to have to choose between those two options, in most cases, I'd go with taking in a too large jacket. I can't say, however, that's always the best approach for it depends on the jacket and one's shape. Sometimes one has to make less than ideal compromises and I can't without "being there" advise one on which suboptimal compromise to chose.
  
  I can say that "too tight" shoulder areas are usually accompanied by too small shoulder openings and that will never result in a comfortable to wear jacket. Invariably, the material of one's shirt will feel "pinched" around the shoulders, upper arm and underarms when the shoulder opening is too narrow or not deep enough (the sleeve diameter is proportionally smaller along with smaller shoulder openings).
  
  
• The key basics that matter:
  • http://www.gq.com/gallery/suits-guide-tailoring-fit
  • http://lifehacker.com/this-visual-gu...fit-1444682567
  • http://www.esquire.com/style/mens-fa...suit-fit-0708/

Insofar as you will be wearing an OTR suit (seeing as you're asking the questions you are), you need to be sure to buy one that is, from square one, designed with your body type in mind. Broadly speaking, there are three basic suit-fit types, or cuts:

• American: American suits are usually reserved for men with larger builds. American-style jackets are often single-breasted and have three buttons, though many men are able to pull off a double-breasted jacket.
• British: Men with a more athletic build should consider a British-style suit, which has an almost military-like quality. These suits are characterized by shorter jacket sleeves, higher lapels, and a nipped-in waist.
• Continental: Men of slim or average build will find continental suits to be very flattering. Popularized by the Italians, continental suits are fairly close-fitting, and the jackets do not have vents in the back.

That's not to say that there aren't American-cut suits designed with thin or athletic types in mind or that there aren't Continental-cut suits made with a heftier fellow in mind. Rather, it's to say that the basic starting point of the three silhouettes favor the noted body types. Going with an OTR suit that is designed and made with your basic body type in mind is always a better place to start than is trying to make a suit made for "that guy over there" look good on one's own body.

(Fit guys with swimmer-type bodies (think actual Olympic swimmers, Zac Efron, or the underwear ad version of Justin Bieber) have it easy; most of them can pretty well choose and wear anything with minimal alterations. If you're into clothes, I suggest that you first spend money to get fit before spending large sums (>$500) on suits.)

The reason it's best to start with a suit geared overall to one's general body shape is the limits of what is possible with alterations. For example, if one is particularly broad shouldered/chested for a given size template, there could quite simple not be enough excess material in to let out, and taking in a jacket enough to make it fit one's broad shoulders/chest could ruin the "line" of the suit. The same concept applies with regard to suit trousers and guys' legs, hips and butt/seat.

The Department Store Dilemma:
When you go shopping for an OTR suit, you're going to end up one of two kinds of places: (1) places that have in-house tailors who'll alter the suit for you, or (2) places that don't have on-staff tailors. Now there's no reason not to trust the skills of an on-staff tailor, but it's important to know that unless they see that the customer seeks to have them alter a suit that will look absolutely ridiculous no matter what they do, they aren't going to say "this isn't the best fitting starting point for you" even when they know based on the store's inventory that there is a better alternative from a "cut" perspective. (They spend their days altering the suits the store sells; they know exactly how every suit in the store is cut and made.)

That may incline one to prefer going to a store that doesn't have in-house tailors. That's a reasonable way to think, but unfortunately, the stores that don't have in-house tailors almost without exception do only have less well made (overall) suits.

So therein we see the dilemma. Now the reality is that a not-so-well crafted suit will, if it happens to fit one perfectly, actually look better than a better made suit that fits less perfectly. The problem is that so-so made suits won't after regular use continue to look better than will a better made suit.

That said, why do guys generally tend to go to a store reputed to sell "better" suits rather than spending far, far less, but don't so with greater frequency, and buy so-so suits that fit them perfectly? I don't know exactly. I do know that vast majority of men don't actually care about the details of fit so long as they don't end up looking like a total slob who appears to be wearing someone else's clothing. Also, even more than the vast majority of men don't care about the details of fit that distinguish a bespoke suit from a reasonably well fitted OTR or made-to-measure (MTM) suit. Moreover, the vast majority of people don't know what those details are, and for everyone concerned, it's probably best that they don't. And truth be told, if one's body is close enough in shape to the template body that used to create OTR and MTM suits, one doesn't need to.

Closing:
I'd tell you what I think of the fit of the suit you're wearing in your photos, but the lighting, to say nothing of the photos being selfies, is so bad I honestly can't tell and I can't see details clearly enough to give you any good input on what's right/wrong with the fit. Hopefully, what I have shared above will give you enough information so you can tell for yourself.

All the best.

[KingOfJericho]

Originally Posted by Whostheboss

I think it looks ok. If you want a tie, yo need to tighten that one more. Or else just go without a tie.

Me i like my pants fitted and i agree about adding a little splash of color.
This was my Easter outfit.

Sharp.

[Whostheboss]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

Sharp.

Thanks dude!

[UncleWede]

"And as any good tailor knows about 'Murican men, on 80% the left testicle hangs lower than the right"

[ASBSECU E93]

Originally Posted by BayMoWe335

You asked, so I'm going to give you an honest opinion.

I'm a classic, finance guy who has worn a lot of suits.

Overall, the suit is a train wreck.

The jacket is ill-fitted and too short in my opinion. It should be closer to your fingertips if you curl your fingers upward slightly.

The shoes are awful.

The pants are way too long.

The tie looks terrible.

Overall, the suit looks extremely cheap and low quality. You don't have to spend $2.5k like I did for a custom suit, but my guess is your suit is well under $500. I think you need to up your game.

If you just need it for one wear, just rent it and come back to suits when you can afford to invest in a good one.

No suit will look good off the rack...must be tailored.

I would start over and go somewhere they know what they're doing for help.

Best advice yet ^^^

I wear a suit M-F as well.

Seek professional help for fitting.

Brown and Burgandy shoes/belt are acceptable for Navy Suits.

Stick with white or ecrew shirt color.

You want the tie to pull out the main color of the suit, but also have hints at the belt/shoe colors. Dark suits can handle bold tie colors, but it must compliment your choice of shoes/belt.

[Delta0311]

Damn you are skinny.. Sell the Bimmer and invest in Chipotle, for like 6 meals a day.

Or follow these simple directions:
1. join gym
2. start training with guy that knows his shit
3. eat, eat, eat
4. steroids
5. magic happens

3 months later you are jacked, look fabulous in suit, and a lot more chick want to ride you..

[newoldbeemer]

Originally Posted by Delta0311

Damn you are skinny.. Sell the Bimmer and invest in Chipotle, for like 6 meals a day.

Or follow these simple directions:
1. join gym
2. start training with guy that knows his shit
3. eat, eat, eat
4. steroids
5. magic happens

3 months later you are jacked, look fabulous in suit, and a lot more chick want to ride you..

Actually I was unholy fat six months back. I'm going through weight loss right now (look 50 pounds in the six months), still have another 20 or so to lose before I start "bulking". Thats why I don't want to invest in good/expensive clothes for this event because I'm sure in one month it will be a bad fit for me.


Ok so I visited the tailor, she pointed out that the pant isn't too long, its too narrow where it ends so instead of going over the shoes it just bunches up. She folded it a half hem and showed me that it would be too short if hemmed. She suggested I find a wider fit.

Im a bit concerned that a wide/loose fit will look ugly. This one is a slim fit. Whats the name of the fit which goes slim all the way through and then wide at the end - is that boot cut, or is that slim straight or something else?

As for the shirt - the one I had was a 14.5 "modern fit". I tried a 14.5 slim fit, turned out to be way too tight pulling on the buttons etc. Do you think I should go up to 15 but keep it slim fit?

[newoldbeemer]

Originally Posted by P1et

Mate, honest question, but why did no one assist you at the shop where you bought this suit? Did no one fit you or measure you? Or did you just walk in, pick up a random suit in your size, pay for it and roll home?

By the way, I always enjoy these threads. When guys at a car forum start talking about dressing well, I always get my popcorn out.

Oh don't get me started on that - they did "assist" me, meaning: whatever I tried on, they would just say "Its perfect!" and brush aside any questions I had.

[UncleWede]

Originally Posted by newoldbeemer

Oh don't get me started on that - they did "assist" me, meaning: whatever I tried on, they would just say "Its perfect!" and brush aside any questions I had.

Find another store if you want to look good.

[GlobalScientist]

T square might be nice if formal. Yes, sleeves look a bit short. Should reach the top part of the thumb below the wrist. I don't like the shoes. Be careful tailoring the pants bc if you use different shoes,the length will be off. My wife works as a fashion buyer and that was what most "women" look at after the fit of the suit. Honestly, I like the look of a good formal loafer. Here is the deal - if you body is changing don't spend too much. Once it settles, spend extra time to get a real tailored suit - make sure the breasting isn't put together with cheap glue or the fit won't look right after a few wears. For me, you can make any suit look sharp with the right accessories: silk tie, cuffs, t square, belt shoes. People like suits with suspender hooks so if you take off your jacket, you look cool - but those type of suits are hard to find without spending $$$.

[newoldbeemer]

I'm going crazy over shirts. Which one of these do you think is the best compromise?

1. 14.5 with modern fit - seems too big to me


2. 14.5 with slim fit - seems way too tight


3. 15 with slim fit - seems ok but still looks loose


What do you think?

[bimmette]

Originally Posted by newoldbeemer

I'm going crazy over shirts. Which one of these do you think is the best compromise?

1. 14.5 with modern fit - seems too big to me
Attachment 1241114

2. 14.5 with slim fit - seems way too tight
Attachment 1241113

3. 15 with slim fit - seems ok but still looks loose
Attachment 1241112

What do you think?

None look like they fit. Can you get them tailored? Otherwise, return them and try on more.

[GlobalScientist]

I'm thinking if you leave the tags on, you'll be a hit at the party + you can return them the next day.

[P1]

Originally Posted by newoldbeemer

Oh don't get me started on that - they did "assist" me, meaning: whatever I tried on, they would just say "Its perfect!" and brush aside any questions I had.

That's not a good thing. Which shop was this? I think it might be best for you to return the items you bought, and find a proper place where they *will* actually do their job and help you. You will likely spend a little bit more, but have a suit that fits perfect and looks the part.

[Whostheboss]

Originally Posted by newoldbeemer

I'm going crazy over shirts. Which one of these do you think is the best compromise?

1. 14.5 with modern fit - seems too big to me


2. 14.5 with slim fit - seems way too tight


3. 15 with slim fit - seems ok but still looks loose


What do you think?

2. Seems to be the best fit out off all 3. At this point, you should just go with whichever one that feels good. It's clear you're not into suits that much.

Just put on whatever looks good, all you got to do is just have a lot of confidence in you. When people sense your level of confidence, they'll quickly dismiss any judgments they have about your suit and respect you.

[UncleWede]

You run into the same issue I do with shirts. IF I get something that fits my neck, even in a slim cut, I float around and my sleeves are way too long.

I once went into what I thought was a reputable seamstress to have address shirt made to fit me. She did all the measuring, I showed he the styling I wanted, picked the materials myself. That was the worst $ I ever spent in my life.

Now, I just don't worry about it much.

Once you start dancing, your shirt is going to be all F@#$ed up anyways. . .

[MrPrena]

Originally Posted by newoldbeemer

I'm going crazy over shirts. Which one of these do you think is the best compromise?

1. 14.5 with modern fit - seems too big to me
Attachment 1241114

2. 14.5 with slim fit - seems way too tight
Attachment 1241113

3. 15 with slim fit - seems ok but still looks loose
Attachment 1241112

What do you think?

Little small, but not bad.
It will take forever to make it 100% fit. Sometimes people need to be satisified with 95% or 99%.

[ASBSECU E93]

...just for clarity...I know a little something about suits...

[newoldbeemer]

So I just took the 15 shirt to a tailor to be taken in. Luckily he agreed to do it quick and at a very low cost. He is also adjusting my pants.

Wow dressing up is a lot more complicated than I thought!

[BayMoWe335]

Originally Posted by newoldbeemer

I'm going crazy over shirts. Which one of these do you think is the best compromise?

1. 14.5 with modern fit - seems too big to me
Attachment 1241114

2. 14.5 with slim fit - seems way too tight
Attachment 1241113

3. 15 with slim fit - seems ok but still looks loose
Attachment 1241112

What do you think?

These don't seem to fit well. What are your stats? Height/Weight?

Try Brooks Brothers shirts if you have one near by. Their slim fits are good for taller, thinner guys.

[newoldbeemer]

Originally Posted by BayMoWe335

These don't seem to fit well. What are your stats? Height/Weight?

Try Brooks Brothers shirts if you have one near by. Their slim fits are good for taller, thinner guys.

5'7", 150 pounds. The pics don't show it (not sure why) but my waist/tummy is much bigger than my chest/shoulders which I guess its the gist of the problem.