Should I buy this car?

18EM2 · 10-14-2018, 04:32 PM

Hello. I'm looking at buying a 2006 Z4M roadster with 131k miles. It's on a local Toyota used lot. Unfortunately I can't talk to the previous owner to get the history. I have an appointment with the local BMW dealer tomorrow for a PPI. I have just started reading and getting familiar with these cars to get an idea of what problems to look out for and how reliable they tend to be. Any and all input is welcomed.

Thank you

Grumpy Old Man · 10-14-2018, 04:51 PM

Not enough information to comment.....in part and not your fault, as you said you can't talk to the previous owner. How much are they asking? The roadster is generally cheaper than the coupe. Whats the overall condition? Hopefully BMW will be able to locate some service history if it's been done at dealerships......the big issue on them is the Vanos, if it's been addressed then go with your gut.

18EM2 · 10-14-2018, 05:17 PM

Thank you. The overall condition is good; paint interior engine bay. All the dealer had was the Carfax history and it was lacking the regular maintenance reports over the last few years. Usually means the owner prefers diy or an independent shop, but no way to know. It drives solid. Makes all the right noises etc. really hoping the PPI will be informative one way or another.

How much would it typically cost to do the Vanos? What happens if it breaks? Does it just stop working or is it catastrophic? Engine rebuild required?

The price is $11700.

RobMCoupe · 10-15-2018, 06:25 AM

I suggest getting oil analysis check for rod bearing wear. The other common issue is vano bolts backing out. PPI might not catch that because you need to remove VCG to inspect.

RobMCoupe · 10-17-2018, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 18EM2

Thank you. The overall condition is good; paint interior engine bay. All the dealer had was the Carfax history and it was lacking the regular maintenance reports over the last few years. Usually means the owner prefers diy or an independent shop, but no way to know. It drives solid. Makes all the right noises etc. really hoping the PPI will be informative one way or another.

How much would it typically cost to do the Vanos? What happens if it breaks? Does it just stop working or is it catastrophic? Engine rebuild required?

The price is $11700.

Vanos rebuild price varies. Check the link for ball park prices for S54 maintenance items and cost. I plan on rebuilding my Vanos early next year.

http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=190111

18EM2 · 10-17-2018, 12:25 AM

Thanks you. I'll check it out.

Do these cars have the subframe issue?

RobMCoupe · 10-17-2018, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 18EM2

Thanks you. I'll check it out.

Do these cars have the subframe issue?

No. Subframe issue on E46 M3 and Z3 that is known problem.

racerbruce · 10-17-2018, 09:37 AM

The PPI should be able to ID if ALL fluids, hoses, brakes, etc require immediate service. Suggest paying extra to have the valve cover removed to critically assess the VANOS bolts, etc, and agree w/the previous post to perform a Blackstone oil analysis to assess internal engine wear conditions, principally connecting rod bearing wear status.

If the car is purchased, suggest having the convertible top roof drains cleaned ASAP; this is a known failure of convertible top electric motors due to water intrusion from plugged roof drains.

18EM2 · 10-17-2018, 01:25 PM

Great advice and information. I appreciate it.

rsutoratosu · 10-19-2018, 09:10 AM

yeah, i been living without a top for 4 years now.. i might get it fix next year... miss the convertible days

18EM2 · 10-19-2018, 10:34 AM

I love driving top down but do you think about the more you put it up and down the sooner you'll need to replace it so you drive with the top up more?

How many of you daily your Z4's?

Z4Fool · 10-19-2018, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 18EM2

I love driving top down but do you think about the more you put it up and down the sooner you'll need to replace it so you drive with the top up more?

How many of you daily your Z4's?

Quote:

Originally Posted by 18EM2

I love driving top down but do you think about the more you put it up and down the sooner you'll need to replace it so you drive with the top up more?

How many of you daily your Z4's?

I have a Z4MR for weekends but a 2.0ltr as a daily... no problems except it needs the vanos changed. Not got round to it yet but otherwise good.

18EM2 · 10-19-2018, 05:01 PM

That's a fun combo to be sure. How many miles on your Z4MR?

Finnegan · 10-19-2018, 07:02 PM

Since it could take a couple weeks, or more, to get a Blackstone Analysis of the oil, you could try to use the rod bearing wear issue to negotiate down the price.

Bearing replacement--it really needs to be thought of as consumable like brake rotors on these cars--runs around 1,800. The engine is really quite good, but it does have this (and the VANOS) issues to consider.

For your purchase, I'd assume the car needs bearings (that's a 40-70K mile thing) and factor that into the price. Use it to negotiate a better deal, then have the bearings done.

There are plenty of threads like this one if you search in the Z4 section of the forum. Maybe print a few as back-up to help in negotiations.

3002 tii · 10-20-2018, 12:00 PM

As a former coupe owner who went roadster, just be sure to carefully inspect the condition of the soft top. Make sure it operates smoothly, inspect the fabric up close for any worn spots or thinning areas. The soft top maintenance is the only annoying thing about these cars and adopting one that has been neglected may not be worth it.

APARSHr35 · 10-20-2018, 04:45 PM

I'm not sure why anyone has not said this yet, but $11k is a really damn good deal.
I just picked up a 2007 M Coupe off an auction site last week with hail damage all over the whole car for $13k + fees/shipping and that was a steal. The Roadsters arent worth THAT Much less than the coupes right? The coupes around here are selling for $20k+ with over 100k miles still, so $11k sounds really good to me, even if it needs some work.

18EM2 · 10-21-2018, 01:33 PM

These are all good points. I didn't realize that the rod bearings would have to be replaced more than once. I see that the top costs $2K just for the parts. I drove it again and the clutch engagement is near the top which probably means it's due for a replacement soon? Is there an adjustment possible? My guess is it automatically adjusts and a new clutch is needed.

Despite all these concerns the car is so enticing. I love the way it drives; both handling and shifting through the gears, the sound, putting the top down, and the way it looks.

I just don't want to buy a money pit. From what you're saying if preventative maintenance is done it will be both reliable and enjoyable.

racerbruce · 10-21-2018, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 18EM2

These are all good points. I didn't realize that the rod bearings would have to be replaced more than once. I see that the top costs $2K just for the parts. I drove it again and the clutch engagement is near the top which probably means it's due for a replacement soon? Is there an adjustment possible? My guess is it automatically adjusts and a new clutch is needed.

Despite all these concerns the car is so enticing. I love the way it drives; both handling and shifting through the gears, the sound, putting the top down, and the way it looks.

I just don't want to buy a money pit. From what you're saying if preventative maintenance is done it will be both reliable and enjoyable.

Just a few thoughts - these are NOT empirical numbers:

A Z4M with appx 65K miles....$18K - $22K
A Z4M with 30K miles or less....$30K - $35K

mmm-five · 10-22-2018, 04:15 AM

Clutch & flywheel on mine was replaced at about 140,000 miles.

Not had rod bearings or VANOS issues yet, and I'm on 160,000 miles - but they are on the to do list for the winter.

I don't know if I'm just lucky, or whether the frequent oil services/inspections are helping. When I was doing 25,000 miles a year, it was an oil service every 5,000 miles, inspection 2 every year - didn't bother with the Insp.1.

18EM2 · 10-22-2018, 01:02 PM

Does the Vanos and Bearings issue apply to all years of the S54? BMW never fixed it or recalled it?

mziggy16 · 10-22-2018, 01:24 PM

I bought an '07 Z4MC in March with the assumption of rod bearings and VANOS baked into the price. I had service history back to 30k miles, including 6k-7k regular oil changes.

Vanos+ a valve adjustment ran $2600 and Bearings were $1800. Once the tech got in there it was clear the Vanos needed attention - one of the exhaust tabs was sheared off. The rod bearings were pretty clean though, which was likely due to the short-interval oil changes. Either way, peace of mind.

Also, keep in mind that Blackstone reports are usually most effective when they can show a trend. A single point in time may not tell you something is up.

Have a reputable and thorough indy look at the car. Listen to them.

And don't expect a 12 year old German car to be cheap. They aren't.

What they are, though, is fun as hell. You can't beat the analog driving experience.

Good luck!

StickMon · 10-22-2018, 03:41 PM

'07 won't have the problem with the "VANOS bolts", but all model years are prone to breaking tab(s) off the exhaust hub.

10-14-2018, 04:32 PM	#1
18EM2 Public Last Class 97 Rep 244 Posts Drives: 2018 M2 DCT LBB Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Bay Area iTrader: (0) Garage List 2018 BMW M2 [0.00]	Should I buy this car? Hello. I'm looking at buying a 2006 Z4M roadster with 131k miles. It's on a local Toyota used lot. Unfortunately I can't talk to the previous owner to get the history. I have an appointment with the local BMW dealer tomorrow for a PPI. I have just started reading and getting familiar with these cars to get an idea of what problems to look out for and how reliable they tend to be. Any and all input is welcomed. Thank you __________________ 2018 M2 LLB DCT DP Custom Exhaust 2018 Accord Sport Platinum White Pearl 2013 Mini Cooper S Hardtop Pepper White 2006 M Roadster
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10-14-2018, 04:51 PM	#2
Grumpy Old Man Lieutenant Colonel 6477 Rep 1,966 Posts Drives: Porsche 993, 2015 MB GLK Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Niagara on the Lake iTrader: (0)	Not enough information to comment.....in part and not your fault, as you said you can't talk to the previous owner. How much are they asking? The roadster is generally cheaper than the coupe. Whats the overall condition? Hopefully BMW will be able to locate some service history if it's been done at dealerships......the big issue on them is the Vanos, if it's been addressed then go with your gut.
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10-14-2018, 05:17 PM	#3
18EM2 Public Last Class 97 Rep 244 Posts Drives: 2018 M2 DCT LBB Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Bay Area iTrader: (0) Garage List 2018 BMW M2 [0.00]	Thank you. The overall condition is good; paint interior engine bay. All the dealer had was the Carfax history and it was lacking the regular maintenance reports over the last few years. Usually means the owner prefers diy or an independent shop, but no way to know. It drives solid. Makes all the right noises etc. really hoping the PPI will be informative one way or another. How much would it typically cost to do the Vanos? What happens if it breaks? Does it just stop working or is it catastrophic? Engine rebuild required? The price is $11700. __________________ 2018 M2 LLB DCT DP Custom Exhaust 2018 Accord Sport Platinum White Pearl 2013 Mini Cooper S Hardtop Pepper White 2006 M Roadster
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10-15-2018, 06:25 AM	#4
RobMCoupe Captain 60 Rep 932 Posts Drives: 2007 Z4 M Coupe Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Bay Area iTrader: (6)	I suggest getting oil analysis check for rod bearing wear. The other common issue is vano bolts backing out. PPI might not catch that because you need to remove VCG to inspect.
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10-17-2018, 12:25 AM	#6
18EM2 Public Last Class 97 Rep 244 Posts Drives: 2018 M2 DCT LBB Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Bay Area iTrader: (0) Garage List 2018 BMW M2 [0.00]	Thanks you. I'll check it out. Do these cars have the subframe issue? __________________ 2018 M2 LLB DCT DP Custom Exhaust 2018 Accord Sport Platinum White Pearl 2013 Mini Cooper S Hardtop Pepper White 2006 M Roadster
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10-17-2018, 09:37 AM	#8
racerbruce Brigadier General 3854 Rep 3,004 Posts Drives: 21 X3 & 13 335is E93 Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Seattle iTrader: (1)	The PPI should be able to ID if ALL fluids, hoses, brakes, etc require immediate service. Suggest paying extra to have the valve cover removed to critically assess the VANOS bolts, etc, and agree w/the previous post to perform a Blackstone oil analysis to assess internal engine wear conditions, principally connecting rod bearing wear status. If the car is purchased, suggest having the convertible top roof drains cleaned ASAP; this is a known failure of convertible top electric motors due to water intrusion from plugged roof drains. __________________ Racerbruce
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10-17-2018, 01:25 PM	#9
18EM2 Public Last Class 97 Rep 244 Posts Drives: 2018 M2 DCT LBB Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Bay Area iTrader: (0) Garage List 2018 BMW M2 [0.00]	Great advice and information. I appreciate it. __________________ 2018 M2 LLB DCT DP Custom Exhaust 2018 Accord Sport Platinum White Pearl 2013 Mini Cooper S Hardtop Pepper White 2006 M Roadster
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10-19-2018, 09:10 AM	#10
rsutoratosu Captain 114 Rep 779 Posts Drives: Z4 3.0i Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Chicago, IL iTrader: (0)	yeah, i been living without a top for 4 years now.. i might get it fix next year... miss the convertible days __________________ -Roranji
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10-19-2018, 10:34 AM	#11
18EM2 Public Last Class 97 Rep 244 Posts Drives: 2018 M2 DCT LBB Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Bay Area iTrader: (0) Garage List 2018 BMW M2 [0.00]	I love driving top down but do you think about the more you put it up and down the sooner you'll need to replace it so you drive with the top up more? How many of you daily your Z4's? __________________ 2018 M2 LLB DCT DP Custom Exhaust 2018 Accord Sport Platinum White Pearl 2013 Mini Cooper S Hardtop Pepper White 2006 M Roadster
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10-19-2018, 05:01 PM	#13
18EM2 Public Last Class 97 Rep 244 Posts Drives: 2018 M2 DCT LBB Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Bay Area iTrader: (0) Garage List 2018 BMW M2 [0.00]	That's a fun combo to be sure. How many miles on your Z4MR? __________________ 2018 M2 LLB DCT DP Custom Exhaust 2018 Accord Sport Platinum White Pearl 2013 Mini Cooper S Hardtop Pepper White 2006 M Roadster
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10-19-2018, 07:02 PM	#14
Finnegan Dog Listener 703 Rep 7,850 Posts Drives: Z4M/. Z3M, E36/46 M3 Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Teaching the dog to slalom iTrader: (22)	Since it could take a couple weeks, or more, to get a Blackstone Analysis of the oil, you could try to use the rod bearing wear issue to negotiate down the price. Bearing replacement--it really needs to be thought of as consumable like brake rotors on these cars--runs around 1,800. The engine is really quite good, but it does have this (and the VANOS) issues to consider. For your purchase, I'd assume the car needs bearings (that's a 40-70K mile thing) and factor that into the price. Use it to negotiate a better deal, then have the bearings done. There are plenty of threads like this one if you search in the Z4 section of the forum. Maybe print a few as back-up to help in negotiations.
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10-20-2018, 12:00 PM	#15
3002 tii Lieutenant General 2283 Rep 12,565 Posts Drives: Z4 M, X5, GX460 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: CT iTrader: (99) Garage List F15 X5 xDrive35i [8.75] E86 Z4 M [10.00] F10 550i (Retired) [9.17] F25 X3 xDrive35i (R ... [9.43] E82 135is (Retired) [9.50] E85 Z4 M (Retired) [9.41] E90 328i xDrive (Re ... [9.25] E86 Z4 3.0si (Retired) [9.24]	As a former coupe owner who went roadster, just be sure to carefully inspect the condition of the soft top. Make sure it operates smoothly, inspect the fabric up close for any worn spots or thinning areas. The soft top maintenance is the only annoying thing about these cars and adopting one that has been neglected may not be worth it. __________________ Follow for latest mods
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10-20-2018, 04:45 PM	#16
APARSHr35 Member 4 Rep 15 Posts Drives: 2007 Z4M / 2016 M5 Join Date: Oct 2018 Location: San Diego iTrader: (0)	I'm not sure why anyone has not said this yet, but $11k is a really damn good deal. I just picked up a 2007 M Coupe off an auction site last week with hail damage all over the whole car for $13k + fees/shipping and that was a steal. The Roadsters arent worth THAT Much less than the coupes right? The coupes around here are selling for $20k+ with over 100k miles still, so $11k sounds really good to me, even if it needs some work.
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10-21-2018, 01:33 PM	#17
18EM2 Public Last Class 97 Rep 244 Posts Drives: 2018 M2 DCT LBB Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Bay Area iTrader: (0) Garage List 2018 BMW M2 [0.00]	These are all good points. I didn't realize that the rod bearings would have to be replaced more than once. I see that the top costs $2K just for the parts. I drove it again and the clutch engagement is near the top which probably means it's due for a replacement soon? Is there an adjustment possible? My guess is it automatically adjusts and a new clutch is needed. Despite all these concerns the car is so enticing. I love the way it drives; both handling and shifting through the gears, the sound, putting the top down, and the way it looks. I just don't want to buy a money pit. From what you're saying if preventative maintenance is done it will be both reliable and enjoyable. __________________ 2018 M2 LLB DCT DP Custom Exhaust 2018 Accord Sport Platinum White Pearl 2013 Mini Cooper S Hardtop Pepper White 2006 M Roadster
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10-22-2018, 04:15 AM	#19
mmm-five First Lieutenant 222 Rep 375 Posts Drives: 2006 Z4MC + 2015 320D M-Sport Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: Liverpool, UK iTrader: (0)	Clutch & flywheel on mine was replaced at about 140,000 miles. Not had rod bearings or VANOS issues yet, and I'm on 160,000 miles - but they are on the to do list for the winter. I don't know if I'm just lucky, or whether the frequent oil services/inspections are helping. When I was doing 25,000 miles a year, it was an oil service every 5,000 miles, inspection 2 every year - didn't bother with the Insp.1.
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10-22-2018, 01:02 PM	#20
18EM2 Public Last Class 97 Rep 244 Posts Drives: 2018 M2 DCT LBB Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Bay Area iTrader: (0) Garage List 2018 BMW M2 [0.00]	Does the Vanos and Bearings issue apply to all years of the S54? BMW never fixed it or recalled it? __________________ 2018 M2 LLB DCT DP Custom Exhaust 2018 Accord Sport Platinum White Pearl 2013 Mini Cooper S Hardtop Pepper White 2006 M Roadster
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10-22-2018, 01:24 PM	#21
mziggy16 Private First Class 31 Rep 135 Posts Drives: '07 Z4MC, '01 911 C4 Cabriolet Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: St. Louis, MO iTrader: (1)	I bought an '07 Z4MC in March with the assumption of rod bearings and VANOS baked into the price. I had service history back to 30k miles, including 6k-7k regular oil changes. Vanos+ a valve adjustment ran $2600 and Bearings were $1800. Once the tech got in there it was clear the Vanos needed attention - one of the exhaust tabs was sheared off. The rod bearings were pretty clean though, which was likely due to the short-interval oil changes. Either way, peace of mind. Also, keep in mind that Blackstone reports are usually most effective when they can show a trend. A single point in time may not tell you something is up. Have a reputable and thorough indy look at the car. Listen to them. And don't expect a 12 year old German car to be cheap. They aren't. What they are, though, is fun as hell. You can't beat the analog driving experience. Good luck! __________________ CURRENT: '07 Z4 M Coupe /// ‘01 911 C4 Cab SOLD: '06 330i / '07 335i / '07 X5 4.8 / '13 335i
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10-22-2018, 03:41 PM	#22
StickMon My other car is on Mars 636 Rep 3,124 Posts Drives: 2006 MR Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Lo-Cal iTrader: (1)	'07 won't have the problem with the "VANOS bolts", but all model years are prone to breaking tab(s) off the exhaust hub. __________________ Warning: May contain traces of nuts.
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