Different requirement for exhaust

Ubermensch · 07-11-2010, 06:43 PM

I know the exhaust bit has been done to death, but I have a probably completely different requirement than most.

I want more rasp.

All the exhaust reviews/comments I've seen talk about how much deeper such and such exhaust sounds and how it cuts down or completely removes the rasp. Hell no. I love how the S54 has that raspy edge that sounds very Italian. If I wanted a deep sound I'd be driving an American V8. I find Ferraris are the best sounding cars in the world with their flat-cranks. I will one day have a 355 or 360 (355 looks and sounds better, but requires more engine-out maintenance).

So here's the golden question, do any of the aftermarket exhausts either take the stock sound and amplify it and/or add rasp?

I know the RPI would probably fill this requirement, but my days of ear-bleeding drone are over. The best sounding car I ever had was a E39 M5 with straight pipes but dear christ the drone was insane. I plan on doing more than a few 850 mile 1-way trips to visit friends so drone is a big no no.

inTgr8r · 07-11-2010, 06:58 PM

Take out the secondary cats.

mousitch · 07-11-2010, 07:07 PM

Headers will give you a little rasp too. I imagine eliminating the secondarys and adding aftermarket headers with stock cans will give you all the rasp you would want. Of course your looking at $1700 or so unless you go with ebay headers, which might or might not fit

Ubermensch · 07-11-2010, 07:24 PM

I don't want to spend megabucks nor want to get a tune (it's my only car and I'm not going to park it for a few days while I wait for the ECU to come back).

Would an intake alone meet my sound requirements perhaps?

mousitch · 07-11-2010, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ubermensch

I don't want to spend megabucks nor want to get a tune (it's my only car and I'm not going to park it for a few days while I wait for the ECU to come back).

Or a month like yours truly?

Ubermensch · 07-11-2010, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by inTgr8r

Take out the secondary cats.

I was searching the forums about this but couldn't find much. It sounds like our secondary O2 sensors are *before* these cats right? If that's the case then removing those cats shouldn't throw a code me thinks. Could you clarify?

I also was looking at the various SS sections and they all say they only mate up with the SS headers

I hate having a shop fab something up unless I know them well, and since I've been here less than a month I definitely don't know/trust a local shop.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mousitch

Or a month like yours truly?

Your beast will be on the road again soon. At least it better be as I need to hear your setup!

mousitch · 07-11-2010, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ubermensch

I was searching the forums about this but couldn't find much. It sounds like our secondary O2 sensors are *before* these cats right? If that's the case then removing those cats shouldn't throw a code me thinks. Could you clarify?

I also was looking at the various SS sections and they all say they only mate up with the SS headers

I hate having a shop fab something up unless I know them well, and since I've been here less than a month I definitely don't know/trust a local shop.

Your beast will be on the road again soon. At least it better be as I need to hear your setup!

I think the SS xpipe will mate up with the stock mids. The non-resonated version should give you some rasp. Id check it out though. These are like $600.

Ubermensch · 07-11-2010, 08:16 PM

So you think this would just bolt right in with no modifications needed?

[IMG]http://www.**********s.com/zoom_img/SS_E85_M_xpipe_CS_1183667518.JPG[/IMG]

ModBargins' page for it specifically says "***Must be used with 022 043 901 headers."

inTgr8r · 07-11-2010, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ubermensch

I was searching the forums about this but couldn't find much. It sounds like our secondary O2 sensors are *before* these cats right? If that's the case then removing those cats shouldn't throw a code me thinks. Could you clarify?

Correct, sensors are up on the primary cats at the headers.

Ubermensch · 07-11-2010, 08:23 PM

Ok did more digging and section 1 has the secondary cats but it is straight. Section 2 is the x-pipe and has resonators. Resonators are what reduce drone. So I'd want to replace section 1 to get rid of those extra cats, not the x-pipe.

[IMG]http://www.**********s.com/zoom_img/SS_E85_M_connect_pipe_CS_1183664466.JPG[/IMG]

Ubermensch · 07-11-2010, 08:28 PM

Ah hah! The reason ModBargins' pipes say they require the headers is because they are carrying the oversized race versions which are 63.5mm vs the stock 60mm. Looks like I'd need SS part #789812.

Supersprint's Z4M listings

Nate2046 · 07-11-2010, 08:55 PM

If you're looking for rasp I'd say you're on the right track. My jvt headers (eliminate the primary cats) definitely added a raspy edge. I'm tired of the SES light though and I refuse to do a tune so the JVT's are coming off. I have that exact SS section 1 waiting to go in after I get all the codes cleared. I'm hoping the sound will be similar to the headers with the removal of the secondary cats.

mousitch · 07-11-2010, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate2046

If you're looking for rasp I'd say you're on the right track. My jvt headers (eliminate the primary cats) definitely added a raspy edge. I'm tired of the SES light though and I refuse to do a tune so the JVT's are coming off. I have that exact SS section 1 waiting to go in after I get all the codes cleared. I'm hoping the sound will be similar to the headers with the removal of the secondary cats.

Just curious why your not interested in the tune. I have heard some negative things the last couple of days about the tunes. Is it because it's a waste of money or that it could be dangerous? I admit I jumped in and talked to ESS cause the SES was driving me nuts also. So I can be the guinea pig on the SES and the $795 I spent(plus shipping

). I thought i had it whupped when I spent $ for the sim to no avail but I'm glad someone made the effort for an alternative to the tune.I will let you know hopefully before you pull off the headers if it works. If your like me your probably wondering why the hell did I take a perfectly good car and then make it throw a code. I question it myself sometimes especially since Ive been w/o a car for two plus weeks while it gets tuned(long story). Wow I might just have answered my own question.

ZM4000 · 07-12-2010, 05:01 AM

U can use the RPI but after that u will need to isolate ur trunk and back.
I just ordered the isolation if ur interested pm me. if drone is a problem for u dont buy RPI thats for sure. U need to isolate it or else u get deaf

I know for me that its an exhaust that i will not keep all my life.
But u also have the REALLY good side of it. the sound after 3250rpm
It's just insane

Ubermensch · 07-12-2010, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZM4000

U can use the RPI but after that u will need to isolate ur trunk and back.
I just ordered the isolation if ur interested pm me. if drone is a problem for u dont buy RPI thats for sure. U need to isolate it or else u get deaf

I know for me that its an exhaust that i will not keep all my life.
But u also have the REALLY good side of it. the sound after 3250rpm
It's just insane

Where in the RPM band is the drone with the RPI? Also what kind of isolation are you talking about, something similar to dynomat? In a previous car I used some spray on undercoating in the trunk (trunk was stripped bare) and that seemed to work decent enough.

BMPDesign · 07-13-2010, 10:00 PM

If you're looking to add rasp to your M Z4 you have several options that can be installed incrementally until you desired sound is achieved. Essentially, for every resonator and/ or cat you remove, the car will be come more and more raspy.

Also, additional drone is generally a side affect of your rear muffler selection. Though removing cats/ resonators will obviously affect this also (aka, running a full non catted system, headers, straight pipe section I, X-Pipe) you can expect the largest change to come from the muffler choice. This is why I STRONGLY encourage any of my customers with any S54 powered vehicle that if they EVER plan to upgrade the OE headers or section I, that they start with that first BEFORE choosing a muffler. A muffler that may be great with stock headers and section I can become quite a nuisance once headers are installed.

Anyway, back to your original question...

If you plan to stick with the OE headers then I would suggest our section I piping FIRST as it is 100% bolt on and with the removal of the two cats will definitely increase rasp. The 022 789 812 will bolt to the OE headers, the Supersprint 022 043 901 standard header, and the new V2 Stepped Header 022 044 901 or any other aftermarket header that connects to the OE section I.

Part Number: 022 789 812

Your second option to increase rasp would be to install our X-Pipe. This solution is NOT 100% bolt on when installed on an otherwise stock vehicle. Though it will bolt to an OE catted section I, it would require cutting off the OE muffler flanges and then being welded to the OE mufflers.

Part Number: 022 789 813

ZM4000 · 07-14-2010, 03:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ubermensch

Where in the RPM band is the drone with the RPI? Also what kind of isolation are you talking about, something similar to dynomat? In a previous car I used some spray on undercoating in the trunk (trunk was stripped bare) and that seemed to work decent enough.

Well the drone is between 2000 and 3250. When u drive up hill it is pretty heavy drone thats why in my opinion u really need isolation if u wanna keep a healthy lifestyle.
http://sensiblesoundsolutions.com/pr...products_id=32

Here's what i mean. It's build for the very low frequencies without being very heavy build.

Ubermensch · 07-14-2010, 09:35 AM

Thanks for the info guys. What level of sound increase are we talking about above stock for:

1. Replace section 1 with straight pipes
2. Replace section 2 with straight pipes

Both of those combined are about the price of mufflers. I'm going for pure sound here, but to the point were it won't compromise long trips. I've already have an intake on order, so just need to round it out.

07-11-2010, 06:43 PM	#1
Ubermensch Private 4 Rep 97 Posts Drives: white 07 Z4MC Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: St Louis, MO iTrader: (0)	Different requirement for exhaust I know the exhaust bit has been done to death, but I have a probably completely different requirement than most. I want more rasp. All the exhaust reviews/comments I've seen talk about how much deeper such and such exhaust sounds and how it cuts down or completely removes the rasp. Hell no. I love how the S54 has that raspy edge that sounds very Italian. If I wanted a deep sound I'd be driving an American V8. I find Ferraris are the best sounding cars in the world with their flat-cranks. I will one day have a 355 or 360 (355 looks and sounds better, but requires more engine-out maintenance). So here's the golden question, do any of the aftermarket exhausts either take the stock sound and amplify it and/or add rasp? I know the RPI would probably fill this requirement, but my days of ear-bleeding drone are over. The best sounding car I ever had was a E39 M5 with straight pipes but dear christ the drone was insane. I plan on doing more than a few 850 mile 1-way trips to visit friends so drone is a big no no.
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07-11-2010, 06:58 PM	#2
inTgr8r Lieutenant General 2432 Rep 11,667 Posts Drives: M2 Comp Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Toronto iTrader: (10)	Take out the secondary cats. __________________ '21 M2C Hockenheim Silver '18 718 Cayman S Lava Orange (sold) '13 E92 M3 Santorini Blue (sold) '07 Z4 M Coupe Alpine White (sold)
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07-11-2010, 07:07 PM	#3
mousitch Dark Sider 129 Rep 1,779 Posts Drives: 2008 Space Gray Z4MC Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Missouri iTrader: (11) Garage List 2008 Z4M Coupe [7.50]	Headers will give you a little rasp too. I imagine eliminating the secondarys and adding aftermarket headers with stock cans will give you all the rasp you would want. Of course your looking at $1700 or so unless you go with ebay headers, which might or might not fit __________________ [URL=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/153/071jt.jpg/] 2008 Space Grey M Coupe-Euro headers-RPI Scoop-Gruppe M CAI-Eisenmann Race Cans-RE X-pipe-ECU Remap with O2 and EGT delete-H&R Sport springs-Zeck CDV delete-Stock Gloss black powder coated wheels-LED Tekarbon Angel Eyes Project-Michelin Super Sports-Hardwired Uniden R7-H&R front and rear spacers-Alarm module added-stereo amp recoded to vert spec settings
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07-11-2010, 07:24 PM	#4
Ubermensch Private 4 Rep 97 Posts Drives: white 07 Z4MC Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: St Louis, MO iTrader: (0)	I don't want to spend megabucks nor want to get a tune (it's my only car and I'm not going to park it for a few days while I wait for the ECU to come back). Would an intake alone meet my sound requirements perhaps?
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07-11-2010, 08:16 PM	#8
Ubermensch Private 4 Rep 97 Posts Drives: white 07 Z4MC Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: St Louis, MO iTrader: (0)	So you think this would just bolt right in with no modifications needed? [IMG]http://www.********s.com/zoom_img/SS_E85_M_xpipe_CS_1183667518.JPG[/IMG] ModBargins' page for it specifically says "*Must be used with 022 043 901 headers."
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07-11-2010, 08:23 PM	#10
Ubermensch Private 4 Rep 97 Posts Drives: white 07 Z4MC Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: St Louis, MO iTrader: (0)	Ok did more digging and section 1 has the secondary cats but it is straight. Section 2 is the x-pipe and has resonators. Resonators are what reduce drone. So I'd want to replace section 1 to get rid of those extra cats, not the x-pipe. [IMG]http://www.**********s.com/zoom_img/SS_E85_M_connect_pipe_CS_1183664466.JPG[/IMG]
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07-11-2010, 08:28 PM	#11
Ubermensch Private 4 Rep 97 Posts Drives: white 07 Z4MC Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: St Louis, MO iTrader: (0)	Ah hah! The reason ModBargins' pipes say they require the headers is because they are carrying the oversized race versions which are 63.5mm vs the stock 60mm. Looks like I'd need SS part #789812. Supersprint's Z4M listings
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07-11-2010, 08:55 PM	#12
Nate2046 Lieutenant 16 Rep 421 Posts Drives: '11 e92M Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Indianapolis, In iTrader: (2)	If you're looking for rasp I'd say you're on the right track. My jvt headers (eliminate the primary cats) definitely added a raspy edge. I'm tired of the SES light though and I refuse to do a tune so the JVT's are coming off. I have that exact SS section 1 waiting to go in after I get all the codes cleared. I'm hoping the sound will be similar to the headers with the removal of the secondary cats.
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07-12-2010, 05:01 AM	#14
ZM4000 Private First Class 9 Rep 123 Posts Drives: Z4M Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Luxembourg iTrader: (0)	U can use the RPI but after that u will need to isolate ur trunk and back. I just ordered the isolation if ur interested pm me. if drone is a problem for u dont buy RPI thats for sure. U need to isolate it or else u get deaf I know for me that its an exhaust that i will not keep all my life. But u also have the REALLY good side of it. the sound after 3250rpm It's just insane
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07-13-2010, 10:00 PM	#16
BMPDesign Enlisted Member 6 Rep 47 Posts Drives: 2003 M3 Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Tyler, TX iTrader: (0)	If you're looking to add rasp to your M Z4 you have several options that can be installed incrementally until you desired sound is achieved. Essentially, for every resonator and/ or cat you remove, the car will be come more and more raspy. Also, additional drone is generally a side affect of your rear muffler selection. Though removing cats/ resonators will obviously affect this also (aka, running a full non catted system, headers, straight pipe section I, X-Pipe) you can expect the largest change to come from the muffler choice. This is why I STRONGLY encourage any of my customers with any S54 powered vehicle that if they EVER plan to upgrade the OE headers or section I, that they start with that first BEFORE choosing a muffler. A muffler that may be great with stock headers and section I can become quite a nuisance once headers are installed. Anyway, back to your original question... If you plan to stick with the OE headers then I would suggest our section I piping FIRST as it is 100% bolt on and with the removal of the two cats will definitely increase rasp. The 022 789 812 will bolt to the OE headers, the Supersprint 022 043 901 standard header, and the new V2 Stepped Header 022 044 901 or any other aftermarket header that connects to the OE section I. Part Number: 022 789 812 Your second option to increase rasp would be to install our X-Pipe. This solution is NOT 100% bolt on when installed on an otherwise stock vehicle. Though it will bolt to an OE catted section I, it would require cutting off the OE muffler flanges and then being welded to the OE mufflers. Part Number: 022 789 813 __________________ BMP Design - 1-800-648-7278 (9am-6pm CST) BMW Parts Catalog - Facebook
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07-14-2010, 09:35 AM	#18
Ubermensch Private 4 Rep 97 Posts Drives: white 07 Z4MC Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: St Louis, MO iTrader: (0)	Thanks for the info guys. What level of sound increase are we talking about above stock for: 1. Replace section 1 with straight pipes 2. Replace section 2 with straight pipes Both of those combined are about the price of mufflers. I'm going for pure sound here, but to the point were it won't compromise long trips. I've already have an intake on order, so just need to round it out.
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