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      11-20-2017, 12:16 PM   #45
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So I accurately predicted sellers husband would not take responsibility for his deception. Why would I pay more than agreed, that's just an ignorant comment. The amount paid so far to Flor Tostado is 24320.00.
Not sure why Tostado thinks documentation helps his cause but here are a couple for everyone who thinks the paint failed after I accepted the car. I also added a pic showing the paint bubbling and peeling. Notice the primer is perfectly smooth, zero abrasions.
So
Goes like this:
I offer to pay 30k pending inspection by dealer. I also asked a friend to look at it. Following these two inspections Tostado agrees to replace pulley, belts and oil control valve if I pay for parts. I agree but the car would sit for another two weeks so we skip the repairs called out in the PPI. All along Tostado's response to questions about paint is it's in perfect condition and you cannot tell it was replaced except for the lack of clear bra on the front implying that it's newer than the rest of the car. Comes out in the PPI that two wheels have been painted. Again Tostado says he doesn't know about it. I move forward as I plan to replace the wheels anyway. I pay for car to be flatbeded. Three weeks later car arrived. I go to pick it up, and before leaving I remove the tape. The tape reveals two things. First, there are areas on the underside where there was no paint, second, were there is masking tape, some of the paint peels off. The Carrier and I both document, I sign for the car with exceptions. I tried to discuss with Tostado but he is absolute, he will not assume any responsibility for peeling paint. Fast forward, he offers to pay half, I accept so that we can move on. Then he re-contacts me and says he's suing. And here we are.
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      11-20-2017, 12:20 PM   #46
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My dad taught me to "Trust No one". I won't sell or buy a car without being at a bank, in person with the other party and the car writing or cashing a check. That's how I did the last few private sales i was involved in. Not to say remote transactions don't work but there's always a risk and your seeing it here.
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      11-20-2017, 12:26 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by in2twins View Post
So I accurately predicted seller would not take responsibility for his deception. Why would I pay more than agreed that's just an ignorant comment.
Once again, even if this is the fault of the seller, withholding $7,000 for it is simply not reasonable. Get a quote for a respray and hold back only that amount, pay the difference, and start talking to the seller - not us. Hasn't the seller already offered to meet you half-way on the respray cost? And didn't you specifically request that the bumper be taped?? In view of that, I think you have the basis for a very fair settlement of this.
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      11-20-2017, 01:31 PM   #48
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Paint peeled off the bottom of the bumper where it's not visible. I'd be upset, but it's not in some high profile area. Nonetheless, buyer asked for it to be taped, and "signed off" on the tape job to boot. The paint damage is completely on you, buyer. I see nothing undisclosed - based on that pic, the tape peeled the paint off. You had your PPI and friend's inspection, and deemed the car satisfactory. Chalk up the loss, pay the balance, receive your title.
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      11-20-2017, 01:36 PM   #49
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Geez...a guy steps away from the forum for one weekend!
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      11-20-2017, 01:38 PM   #50
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If folks keep indicting me I will respond. The seller retracted his offer to split the repair and given his behavior sending him the difference will not get me my title.
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      11-20-2017, 01:40 PM   #51
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Didn’t your friend thoroughly inspect the paint before you bought?
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      11-20-2017, 01:43 PM   #52
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^ in his defense, he didn't start the thread and was somewhat forced into responding, considering the title includes "fraud"...

IMHO, this could have been settled without a thread, and there are other avenues that should have been pursued before suing.
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      11-20-2017, 01:46 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by in2twins View Post
So I accurately predicted seller would not take responsibility for his deception. Why would I pay more than agreed that's just an ignorant comment.
This is why you are withholding $7K? Are you freek'n kidding me I can honestly say that this type of etiquette disgusts me.

Reading the thread doesn't do a photo justice and after seeing that photo it makes it pretty clear for me. I think you are totally in the wrong and by withholding the funds, you are either an idiot or a scammer IMO. I mean I'm sure you've seen photos of the car before you had it shipped, and to protect your investment you did your due diligence by having a PPI done and had a local buddy check it out and no one mentioned anything about paint. The issue of the paint pealing off only comes after you instructed the seller to tape it up, if the bumper wasn't taped it wouldn't of pealed when you removed the tape. I know it sucks but this only happened because of your instruction and unfortunately it was an unforeseen mistake on your part that they seller should not have to pay for and I too would not be willing to split the repaint. Not to mention that bottom part of the skirt is so prone to rock and stone chips it be touched up with a rattle can or wrap it black as most of use do for under $100.

Suck it up and pay the man his money and don't make it any worse then it already is. It's totally disgusting that your withholding $7k for that. Toss it up to to a lesson learned and move on.
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      11-20-2017, 02:01 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclops View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by in2twins View Post
So I accurately predicted seller would not take responsibility for his deception. Why would I pay more than agreed that's just an ignorant comment.
This is why you are withholding $7K? Are you freek'n kidding me I can honestly say that this type of etiquette disgusts me.

Reading the thread doesn't do a photo justice and after seeing that photo it makes it pretty clear for me. I think you are totally in the wrong and by withholding the funds, you are either an idiot or a scammer IMO. I mean I'm sure you've seen photos of the car before you had it shipped, and to protect your investment you did your due diligence by having a PPI done and had a local buddy check it out and no one mentioned anything about paint. The issue of the paint pealing off only comes after you instructed the seller to tape it up, if the bumper wasn't taped it wouldn't of pealed when you removed the tape. I know it sucks but this only happened because of your instruction and unfortunately it was an unforeseen mistake on your part that they seller should not have to pay for and I too would not be willing to split the repaint. Not to mention that bottom part of the skirt is so prone to rock and stone chips it be touched up with a rattle can or wrap it black as most of use do for under $100.

Suck it up and pay the man his money and don't make it any worse then it already is. It's totally disgusting that your withholding $7k for that. Toss it up to to a lesson learned and move on.
He doesn't have the title yet, from what I understand... and the remaining amount to be paid is the buyer's only bargaining piece. He's waiting for both parties to come to an agreement before releasing the funds. I'm not agreeing one way or another. Yes, it should have happened before the sale. Given the current situation, both parties should agree to an amount that would allow the seller to release the title upon receipt of the specified funds.
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      11-20-2017, 02:27 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pokeybritches View Post
He doesn't have the title yet, from what I understand... and the remaining amount to be paid is the buyer's only bargaining piece. He's waiting for both parties to come to an agreement before releasing the funds. I'm not agreeing one way or another. Yes, it should have happened before the sale. Given the current situation, both parties should agree to an amount that would allow the seller to release the title upon receipt of the specified funds.
As others mentioned, both are holding onto their leverage $7K & Title and neither will give up that leverage until they get what they want so escrow is the solution here. However my issue isn't with that, it's with the fact that buyer wants to be compensated for damage done to the car upon his instruction to cover the bumper with tape, the seller didn't intentionally cover damaged paint, that just doesn't make send to me and IMO is just not right.

That's it for my 2 cents.
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      11-20-2017, 02:35 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclops View Post
As others mentioned, both are holding onto their leverage $7K & Title and neither will give up that leverage until they get what they want so escrow is the solution here. However my issue isn't with that, it's with the fact that buyer wants to be compensated for damage done to the car upon his instruction to cover the bumper with tape, the seller didn't intentionally cover damaged paint, that just doesn't make send to me and IMO is just not right.

That's it for my 2 cents.
How could you possibly know the seller's husband's intent?
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      11-20-2017, 03:07 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by in2twins View Post
How could you possibly know the seller's husband's intent?
Because your friend inspected it before it was taped, and it was only taped at your request. That is a pretty good indication of the lack of intent.
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      11-20-2017, 03:13 PM   #58
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Not to move off topic, but I've had 2 bumpers resprayed, scuffed to shit and i have yet to see paint peel or flake off...I can comfortably say I could wrap my car with gorilla tape and it wouldn't peel the paint.
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      11-20-2017, 03:25 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by in2twins View Post
If folks keep indicting me I will respond. The seller retracted his offer to split the repair and given his behavior sending him the difference will not get me my title.
What would make you suspect this? He already told you he would send it when you paid(he has not broken the contract so far, you have). He has no reason not to send it when he is paid as this will fulfill the contract. Personally, I would not have offered to split any repainting costs with you but since he did, why not get an estimate at your favorite repair shop, send him a copy of it and offer to send a check for 7k + PPI cost + Overnight mail cost - 1/2 cost of respray?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkeye View Post
Because your friend inspected it before it was taped, and it was only taped at your request. That is a pretty good indication of the lack of intent.
Exactly. The tape was at the BUYERS request. The seller wasn't hiding anything.
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      11-20-2017, 03:27 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by in2twins View Post
How could you possibly know the seller's husband's intent?
I don't, but common sense tells me since they complied with all your requests to have the car checked out by 2 separate third parities, the actual willingness to work with an out of state buyer and send the car without getting fully paid for it (that just crazy) furthermore, did you a favor by taping up the front per your request really doesn't sound like they are trying to screw you over.
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      11-20-2017, 04:34 PM   #61
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Buyer posted happy photo and video of the car post-arrival in HI here. No mention of peeling paint, nor can I see it in the photo or video. This tape thing, well, I dunno. Sniff sniff.

It does look like a poorly prepped bumper respray.

The thing is, it passed a PPI (that is as-yet unreimbursed) and a friend's look-see. I have no reason to doubt that the seller was as clueless about its condition as the PPI performer and the friend of the buyer were. I keep having a hard time finding fault with the seller here.

[Quick note to folks complaining about the existence of the thread. I am subscribed to another forum where unresolved issues are frequently aired in public. It works surprisingly well there at bringing about resolution, or at worst clarifying who to trust. Hopefully it will work here too.]
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      11-20-2017, 09:58 PM   #62
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OP, I feel bad for you to have to deal with an ignorant guy like this. The buyer should give the seller his money and stop being a shady scammer, no one will want to engage in transactions with you on this forum after reading this thread.
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      11-21-2017, 12:47 AM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclops View Post
As others mentioned, both are holding onto their leverage $7K & Title and neither will give up that leverage until they get what they want so escrow is the solution here.
I agree. Escrow is the solution.

Buyer - Buyer should pay PPI. Paint repairs could be negotiated, but will likely come back to the buyer to pay for half or all of it. If paint repairs were part of a requirement of the sale, it should have been documented. If two pre-purchase inspections did not uncover the flaws, and the seller didn't intentionally withhold information, it's up to the buyer to rectify.

Seller - Starting an emotionally charged thread which throws around accusations of fraud and lawsuits essentially ends any sort of negotiations. It's the interest of both parties to move forward, and if negotiations are shut down, there is no moving forward without a lengthy, expensive process. There are other options available that wouldn't have shut down the other party and would have pressured the buyer to move. If you wanted to go the forum route, you could have posted a thread requesting forum assistance with "dispute resolution" (rather than telling us to beware of fraud, which is criminal deception), where both sides are invited to explain their sides.
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      11-21-2017, 12:50 AM   #64
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for those that feel sorry for the dishonest guy. If he tried to rip you off and you caught him I suppose you'd be fine with that. Anyway, sad that a supposed enthusiast forum has a bunch of folks that tolerate dishonest sellers, anywhere else he'd be banned. Oh wait, he joined the forum to post one thread. You think he's ignorant, and that makes dishonesty ok? You should buy his wheels, good luck. To the OP how about your lawyer calls me? Anyone who thinks this guy is gonna mail a title after being paid hasn't been paying attention. There is a reason he couldn't sell a low mile Interlagos coupe for months despite being listed on national forums. This was no favor on his part, rather a ripoff I will not tolerate. I took a risk but I also protected myself.
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      11-21-2017, 01:09 AM   #65
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Escrow requires an agreement and there isn't one. Seller never said he didn't know about the paint so I'm not sure why he deserves that defense. Concealed defect is exactly what it sounds like.
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      11-21-2017, 02:15 AM   #66
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Quote:
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Escrow requires an agreement and there isn't one. Seller never said he didn't know about the paint so I'm not sure why he deserves that defense. Concealed defect is exactly what it sounds like.
What would stop you both from using an escrow to transfer the title and pay the remaining balance? Is it only the agreement about the front bumper paint?
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