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07-19-2012, 11:18 AM | #1 |
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DSC OFF
How many of you drive with that DSC garbage off on a regular basis? I had never realized that it was always on until last night, it's no wonder I couldn't fishtail the thing! It's staying off from now on! What do yall think about that? How often do you slide the car?
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07-19-2012, 11:44 AM | #2 |
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DSC comes off when I'm autocrossing or track. No where else unless I'm driving back roads I know well.
Sorry, I don't risk it with DSC off on local roads. I'm not like other idiots who try to slide on public roads. I don't ever slide the car intentionally either. |
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07-19-2012, 11:51 AM | #3 |
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Leave off only on track, and that's only after I'm comfortable with the layout. Leave it on for public roads, may need it that one time the roads are too slick. And to be honest, to "benefit" from turning it off on public roads means I'm probably driving like a d*ck, which I try not to do.
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07-19-2012, 11:59 AM | #5 |
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To and from work i keep it on and shift 1-3-5 just b/c its long stretches of road and very little stop and go. On the weekends its usually off.
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07-19-2012, 12:03 PM | #6 |
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I thought the system was just an extra handicap but it sounds like the car was designed around it, does that sound correct? I was hoping to drive it like I drive the Porsches, but if it doesn't like that then I guess I'll just drive it gentle
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07-19-2012, 12:06 PM | #7 | |
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BTW - Trying to slide a car with an open diff isn't going to work well. Happy 1 wheel spins |
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07-19-2012, 12:13 PM | #8 |
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I meant like it was intended to stay on and not be turned off? All 3 Porsches have open diffs and no traction control and they handle it perfectly. Why wouldn't the BMW be able to??
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07-19-2012, 12:35 PM | #9 | |
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Open diffs just suck. You can't properly power down in a turn. |
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07-19-2012, 12:40 PM | #11 | |
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I know less about the non-M version, but I believe "DSC" has three modes on the non-M, unlike the M which is simply on and off. One is on. The second is where traction control is off (which means the car won't cut power when the rear wheel spin) but stability control is still on (car will brake if it senses you're going to understeer into a tree for example). The third is everything off. Recommend consulting the manual for the various modes. From my perspective, the car isn't designed around the electronic safety measures, these are simply modern safety devices and systems that customers (and now regulations) require. Recent MY Porsche cars have these systems as well; your MY90 Porsche does not as it's prior to the advent of these systems. The Z4 isn't designed around it, it's simply standard equipment. You're going to get a reaction from most folks on this site about running with DSC off on the road, and kicking out the rear end. Lots of track and AutoX enthusiasts here. We'll happily power oversteer with DSC off when it helps our times or we want to have some fun in a controlled environment--but driving at 9 and 10 10ths on public roads is going to generally be frowned upon. It's not my place to tell you how to drive. I can simply say that for me I find there are too many unpredictable variables (other cars, road conditions, people, animals) on the road for me to drive the car in a manner I'd do in an AutoX or on the track. YMMD. |
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07-19-2012, 12:44 PM | #12 | |
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07-19-2012, 01:16 PM | #13 | |
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If anyone has that hard cover book handy that talks about the initial design of the Z4, I think it mentions at one point about how the DSC and DTC functions were set up to enhance the car's handling under normal usage conditions. While safety of the car is a big factor, there is also handling optimization etc. But I could be wrong on that - I don't have a copy nearby to look at.
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07-19-2012, 02:12 PM | #14 |
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I found the z4 was FAR more squirrely than the M is with traction on. If weather is great, DSC off. If the weather is wet at all i keep it on. I find it drives a little nicer without it on, for my taste at least. In my z4 i kept it on all the time. The car just wanted to rotate too much, but not in a way i enjoy.
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07-19-2012, 02:17 PM | #15 |
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Page 54 of 'BMW Z4: Design, Development And Production by David Lightfoot'
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07-19-2012, 02:29 PM | #17 |
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I've driven multiple ZCPs on track. The MZ4 Coupe's normal DSC ON mode is far closer to the ZCP's M Track Mode than any DSC equipped car built prior to 2006.
The DSC on the MZ4 Coupe will allow you up anywhere between 5-10º of additional slip angle before it tries to reign you in. It's far more advanced than the non competition E46 M3's DSC and it is certainly on-par with the ZCP's DSC if you ask me.
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07-19-2012, 02:33 PM | #18 | |
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07-19-2012, 02:38 PM | #19 | |
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It allows enough slip angle with PROPER driving before it kicks in and corrects. It will intervene with the gas and brake if you try to hammer it out of a turn too early (just like the M Track Mode). |
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07-19-2012, 02:42 PM | #20 |
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I keep the non-M in DTC mode for safety reasons. I told myself I would never be that person that pulled into traffic and didn't go anywhere... then one day the car cut torque for an eternity as I watched cars behind me swell in my rear view mirror. Never again. DTC mode allows a reasonable amount of wheel slip and a shorter duration of intrusion, though I wish there was a sport mode with even less intervention.
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07-19-2012, 03:00 PM | #21 |
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07-19-2012, 03:03 PM | #22 |
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Sounds like the Z4 (2.5, 3.0) were, as the OP thought, and Huz and Ship noted, designed around the DSC and DTC functions. M seems to have been too, but with some differences (owning to suspension, differential, and power levels.)
It also sounds like "mode 2" (DTC) is the place to be with the non-M version of the car for both safety and fun reasons if road conditions warrant (as Pokey and strokeZ points out). Probably pros and cons there too. Seems like that mode is more equivalent to running DSC on in the M, since, like The Hack says, you've got quite a bit of slip angle to play with in the M even with DSC on. Quite a good discussion here, and it clarified some differences in the electronics between Z4 models for me. Set-up (DSC on/off) between the two certainly are not equivalent. Last edited by Finnegan; 07-19-2012 at 05:46 PM.. |
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