Euro Header install

[MPOWER78]

Originally Posted by johanness

Update: Ghost in the Machine

So by now, with all the dicking around and expense, I could have just purchased a new Euro Sec 1. Regardless, I've had to cut into my Section 1 three different times in this order:

1)Relocate O2's and EGT (as per 1st page) - End result = CEL
2)On suggestion, cut back longer J-bung to standard others have used & reinstall - CEL again.
3)On another suggestion, move bungs farther back a couple of inches - yep CEL

Funny thing is, this afternoon I noticed my NAV wasn't working. The screen just said "please wait" or something like that. Park the car, arm the alarm... and a fan under the hood starts up. Goes for a few minutes and shuts off. First time I've heard that since I've owned it. I'm like 'hmm strange'.

Head to the grocery store. CEL still on, and no NAV. Come out, and BINGO --> Nav is working again and I have no CEL.

*Scratches head*

If anyone has an idea, I'm all ears.

thats wierd ? so what about the cel is it still on and what code is it ?

[johanness]

Originally Posted by RobMCoupe

Did you eject the DVD and clean it. It might have problem reading it.

Yeah, did that and the same thing happened. However, now it's working. Strange.

Originally Posted by MPOWER78

thats wierd ? so what about the cel is it still on and what code is it ?

No CEL! *knocks on wood* Travelled about 50 miles today and felt like a hot damn with no codes and Nav intact.

Sound sample with the Headers/SS-Xpipe/Remus combo - to follow

[Jumbosock]

Did you double check the post cat O2 sensors to make sure the banks were correct?

[johanness]

Yes. They were deliberately switched to try and omit that as an issue, but as soon as they switched them, there was an error saying as much. You can't get away with running them switched as it turns out.

[Jumbosock]

Originally Posted by johanness

Yes. They were deliberately switched to try and omit that as an issue, but as soon as they switched them, there was an error saying as much. You can't get away with running them switched as it turns out.

Cool! Thanks for checking that out. When I did this euro change in my e46 M3 I welded the EGT sensor into the header similar to the USA location. I had no problems. Without going Euro tune I wonder if a header location for the EGT sensor would be better.

[boboleto]

I have the same question as Jumbo, wonder whats the reason behind moving the egt downstream into section 1 pipes?

[inTgr8r]

Originally Posted by boboleto

I have the same question as Jumbo, wonder whats the reason behind moving the egt downstream into section 1 pipes?

Just a wild ass guess, but maybe it's related to the monitoring of the secondary O2s.
CATs don't function properly until warmed up.
The O2s data may be analyzed based on temperature feedback from the EGT.

If the EGT is up on the headers it would heat up much more quickly than back at the inlet to the CATs.
The ECU might be fooled into thinking the CATs are fully warmed up too soon.

There is usually a reason for sensor placement.

[ZStig]

thats what I tried to tell him

anyway, its also very important to change the gaskets on the headers, don't forget

[Jumbosock]

I understand that the EGT monitoring is best placed adjacent to the cats for proper readings. I was just thinking that the fault code "2C93 - Exhaust gas temp sensor plausibility" might be resolved by keeping the EGT sensor in the header if the North American software is not changed to Euro.

[johanness]

Well this Wed, we're going to be comparing EGT readings by running two Z4M's side by side (mine and fellow member JDN34) and getting direct temperature comparisons. So (as an example) if my car is reading 80 degrees, and his 140... Then we'll know that the EGT should be repositioned on the header to get rid of the CEL (which came back on btw).

[inTgr8r]

Originally Posted by Jumbosock

I understand that the EGT monitoring is best placed adjacent to the cats for proper readings. I was just thinking that the fault code "2C93 - Exhaust gas temp sensor plausibility" might be resolved by keeping the EGT sensor in the header if the North American software is not changed to Euro.

good point.

[inTgr8r]

Originally Posted by johanness

Well this Wed, we're going to be comparing EGT readings by running two Z4M's side by side (mine and fellow member JDN34) and getting direct temperature comparisons. So (as an example) if my car is reading 80 degrees, and his 140... Then we'll know that the EGT should be repositioned on the header to get rid of the CEL (which came back on btw).

It will be interesting to see that data.

[johanness]

Finally getting around to doing the comparison mentioned above. This Friday I should have some detailed info.

FYI... My CEL comes and goes. On/Off/On/Off. No change in power delivery, nothing. Not even any rhyme or reason when it goes on/off either.

Hopefully Friday will help solve stuff.

[johanness]

Update (more like a breakthrough):

It pains me to say, but the reason for everything (my CEL, my excessive rasp, the hair stuck between my fingers torn from my scalp) was a simple EXHAUST LEAK (pre or post Section 1 - i'm thinking pre). That was the reason I was getting random O2 & EGT plausibility faults (triggering a CEL).

I needed a different set of eyes on the issue, so the exhaust was removed from the header back, inspected and replaced. Lo and behold, my car not only sounded better (all out the back), but I haven't had a CEL in over 200 miles. (still knocking on &^%$ing wood tho - old habits...)

The indy shop I used originally (CG Motorsports) obviously shat the bed when it came to the installation. Maybe they re-used a set of gaskets or the like, but it was enough to throw my codes out of whack and trigger a CEL. I have real issues with their work because it was back THREE times to sort out this mess - on my dime. I'm not even sure how it's possible for them to miss something like this.
The bottom line... our sniffers must be quite sensitive to even the smallest exhaust leaks.

Regardless, I now hope to join the many others who haven't experienced any issues (CEL's etc) with their O2 sensor relocation.

[inTgr8r]

That's great news.
How did they find it?

[johanness]

They weren't specifically looking for it. They just replaced the gaskets anew, reassembled, and PRESTO.

...

[EMP07]

Originally Posted by Roffle Waffle

thats what I tried to tell him

anyway, its also very important to change the gaskets on the headers, don't forget

Now made clearer by virtue of the findings.

Good call.

[johanness]

Originally Posted by Roffle Waffle

thats what I tried to tell him

anyway, its also very important to change the gaskets on the headers, don't forget

Originally Posted by F1soul

Now made clearer by virtue of the findings.

Good call.

The gaskets & bolts on the headers were brand new and never in question. The placement of the EGT sensor (and O2's) is just fine. It was an exhaust leak on either end of the Sec 1 (not sure which).

[EMP07]

Originally Posted by johanness

The gaskets & bolts on the headers were brand new and never in question. The placement of the EGT sensor (and O2's) is just fine. It was an exhaust leak on either end of the Sec 1 (not sure which).

Good to know. Interesting though how it occurred after the install, assuming nothing on the other sections were touched?

[johanness]

Originally Posted by F1soul

Good to know. Interesting though how it occurred after the install, assuming nothing on the other sections were touched?

Section 1 was removed twice after a flawless header install and all wiring traced etc. The other sections (from the header back) were most certainly touched. However, it wasn't till the last time that the NEW shop corrected the fault/leak.

Moral of the story is check ur gaskets/connections. Very important

[EMP07]

Originally Posted by johanness

Section 1 was removed twice after a flawless header install and all wiring traced etc. The other sections (from the header back) were most certainly touched. However, it wasn't till the last time that the NEW shop corrected the fault/leak.

Moral of the story is check ur gaskets/connections. Very important

Of course section 1 needed to be removed, sorry long day.

My EU headers have been sitting in my garage for the last 6 months, so i've been observing others attempt installs. Time to get it going.

Glad things worked.

[ZeD4Mr]

Glad it worked out for you... You have spent good amount time on getting it resolved. Time to get mine going..