06 Z4M R Vanos Cam Bolts

onebluemcm · 10-25-2010, 12:26 AM

Is this job potentially harder to do on a Z4 compared to an M3 because of the clearance between the VANOS unit and the front cross member?

inTgr8r · 10-25-2010, 06:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XMetal

Hopefully you're correct and my '08 should have the new bolts

It should.
There was a member with a mid '07 MY that inspected his and found the new style bolts.

There's thread here some where with the info.
We still don't know when in the '07 MY that the change was made though.

[edit]
found the Vanos thread by Blind32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blind32

2007 Z4M Coupe with a production date of 12/2006 .....
.... there wasn't any damage to them and they seemed to be torqued to spec when I removed them. When I got down to them, I expected to see hex bolts but mine were torx and looked exactly like the new bolts

dekaliber · 10-25-2010, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by inTgr8r

It should.
There was a member with a mid '07 MY that inspected his and found the new style bolts.

There's thread here some where with the info.
We still don't know when in the '07 MY that the change was made though.

[edit]
found the Vanos thread by Blind32

Good find. Blind32's car was 12/22/06 I think.

Ron Stygar · 10-25-2010, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by inTgr8r

It should.
There was a member with a mid '07 MY that inspected his and found the new style bolts.

There's thread here some where with the info.
We still don't know when in the '07 MY that the change was made though.

[edit]
found the Vanos thread by Blind32

536 superceded at 09/2007. Click on NA to see.

http://www.penskeparts.com/DiagramsR...iagram=11_3004

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...1&postcount=56

inTgr8r · 10-25-2010, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Stygar

536 superceded at 09/2007. Click on NA to see.

http://www.penskeparts.com/DiagramsR...iagram=11_3004

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...1&postcount=56

Thanks Ron.

If it was superceded 09/2007, I wonder if that was engine production date or car assembly date?
If engine date, then it's hard to know when that engine made it to car assembly.

O-cha · 10-25-2010, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onebluemcm

Is this job potentially harder to do on a Z4 compared to an M3 because of the clearance between the VANOS unit and the front cross member?

Yes.

Ron Stygar · 10-25-2010, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by inTgr8r

Thanks Ron.

If it was superceded 09/2007, I wonder if that was engine production date or car assembly date?
If engine date, then it's hard to know when that engine made it to car assembly.

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23433

Z4 M Coupe: LL93033 May 2006

6 157 3 765
32 6 S4

inTgr8r · 10-25-2010, 10:47 AM

Much appreciated Ron.

pokeybritches · 10-25-2010, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O-cha

I don't think it's the bolts themselves, Just that when replaced they are torqued properly and locktighted. The bolts are the same grade as far as I know.

The new style bolts just mean that they are torqued properly, and not that the bolts themselves have anything to do with it? Is the problem that over-torquing the old-style bolts is causing them to shear?

Sorry for the flood of questions, but is this something someone with basic mechanical knowledge can check (not replace) themselves? From the pictures it looks like you can just pop off a few covers and take a look. The last thing I want to do is make a trip to a good S54 tech that's several hundred miles out of the way, only to find out that I actually have properly-torqued bolts.

inTgr8r · 10-25-2010, 11:41 AM

IIRC the only difference is new bolts have a thread lock on them. (other than being Torx)

O-cha · 10-25-2010, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokeybritches

The new style bolts just mean that they are torqued properly, and not that the bolts themselves have anything to do with it? Is the problem that over-torquing the old-style bolts is causing them to shear?

Sorry for the flood of questions, but is this something someone with basic mechanical knowledge can check (not replace) themselves? From the pictures it looks like you can just pop off a few covers and take a look. The last thing I want to do is make a trip to a good S54 tech that's several hundred miles out of the way, only to find out that I actually have properly-torqued bolts.

No you won't be able to check them without the tools to retime the motor, because you will have to retime it as soon as the bolts for the vanos gear are loosened and especially when it's removed.

Ron Stygar · 10-25-2010, 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O-cha

The bolts are the same grade as far as I know.

Correct. Both 8.8.

Shereef_Osman · 10-25-2010, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O-cha

No you won't be able to check them without the tools to retime the motor, because you will have to retime it as soon as the bolts for the vanos gear are loosened and especially when it's removed.

How would one know if the motor was timed correctly? I have had my vanos replaced three times now. This third time, my fuel economy has gone down drastically.

pokeybritches · 10-25-2010, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O-cha

No you won't be able to check them without the tools to retime the motor, because you will have to retime it as soon as the bolts for the vanos gear are loosened and especially when it's removed.

Thanks! Guess I'll be making a stop by Orlando when I drive across the country early next year...

O-cha · 10-25-2010, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shereef_Osman

How would one know if the motor was timed correctly? I have had my vanos replaced three times now. This third time, my fuel economy has gone down drastically.

Vanos replacement is not the same thing as what we are talking about. Vanos can be replaced without retiming. As for checking timing, it requires a tool "gauge" and it's damn hard to check because the vanos pistons don't like to move (you have to move them to full stop). It's almost easier to retime the motor then to actually just check the timing.

There's a hole in each cam and the tool sits in it, if its flat its timed correctly, if not, not.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokeybritches

Thanks! Guess I'll be making a stop by Orlando when I drive across the country early next year...

If for no other reason then to check out some fast cars.

Shereef_Osman · 10-25-2010, 08:32 PM

^ Thanks for the explanation. Would you have to retime the motor if you change the cam lobes?

O-cha · 10-25-2010, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shereef_Osman

^ Thanks for the explanation. Would you have to retime the motor if you change the cam lobes?

Camshaft? Yes, of course.

Shereef_Osman · 10-25-2010, 08:36 PM

They replaced those the third time as well, lol. So what would one notice if the motor weren't timed correctly from a drivers perspective?

O-cha · 10-25-2010, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shereef_Osman

They replaced those the third time as well, lol. So what would one notice if the motor weren't timed correctly from a drivers perspective?

Loss of power, rough running, possible misfires ETC.

Shereef_Osman · 10-25-2010, 08:42 PM

^ So basically it would be quite obvious, got it. Thanks.

O-cha · 10-25-2010, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shereef_Osman

^ So basically it would be quite obvious, got it. Thanks.

Not necessarily it depends on how bad it was, could be unnoticeable other then a little horsepower you can't be sure of.

wrose · 10-27-2010, 05:06 PM

Thanks everyone for the very detailed info. I'll think about it and check the production of my car and during the winter make a decision- No BMW tech locally that I would want doing this ( may have to get 1 of our Audi techs to help-can possibly borrow the special tools )
Thanks again
Wayne

10-25-2010, 12:26 AM	#23
onebluemcm Captain 42 Rep 632 Posts Drives: '07 Z4MC Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Richmond, VA iTrader: (0)	Is this job potentially harder to do on a Z4 compared to an M3 because of the clearance between the VANOS unit and the front cross member? __________________ \|=.-._.-._.-._.-._.-._.-._.-._.-._.-._.-._.-.=\| Silbergrau A08 / Sepang Brown LSD6 / Carbon Leather 4MY (1 of 3, this combo) RAC RG63 \| Conti EC-DW \| GC/Koni-Dinan \| Rogue RSM \| Arqray \| Autosolutions \| BMW brace \| Pinnacle tint
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10-25-2010, 10:47 AM	#30
inTgr8r Lieutenant General 2426 Rep 11,667 Posts Drives: M2 Comp Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Toronto iTrader: (10)	Much appreciated Ron. __________________ '21 M2C Hockenheim Silver '18 718 Cayman S Lava Orange (sold) '13 E92 M3 Santorini Blue (sold) '07 Z4 M Coupe Alpine White (sold)
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10-25-2010, 11:41 AM	#32
inTgr8r Lieutenant General 2426 Rep 11,667 Posts Drives: M2 Comp Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Toronto iTrader: (10)	IIRC the only difference is new bolts have a thread lock on them. (other than being Torx) __________________ '21 M2C Hockenheim Silver '18 718 Cayman S Lava Orange (sold) '13 E92 M3 Santorini Blue (sold) '07 Z4 M Coupe Alpine White (sold)
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10-25-2010, 08:32 PM	#38
Shereef_Osman Second Lieutenant 16 Rep 232 Posts Drives: 06 Z4MC & 89 325is Join Date: May 2010 Location: Toronto, Ontario iTrader: (6)	^ Thanks for the explanation. Would you have to retime the motor if you change the cam lobes?
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10-25-2010, 08:36 PM	#40
Shereef_Osman Second Lieutenant 16 Rep 232 Posts Drives: 06 Z4MC & 89 325is Join Date: May 2010 Location: Toronto, Ontario iTrader: (6)	They replaced those the third time as well, lol. So what would one notice if the motor weren't timed correctly from a drivers perspective?
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10-25-2010, 08:42 PM	#42
Shereef_Osman Second Lieutenant 16 Rep 232 Posts Drives: 06 Z4MC & 89 325is Join Date: May 2010 Location: Toronto, Ontario iTrader: (6)	^ So basically it would be quite obvious, got it. Thanks.
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10-27-2010, 05:06 PM	#44
wrose Private 13 Rep 91 Posts Drives: 2007 Z4MC Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: NS,Canada iTrader: (1) Garage List 2006 Z4M Roadster [8.50] 2007 Z4MC [0.00] 2005 X3 [0.00]	vanos info Thanks everyone for the very detailed info. I'll think about it and check the production of my car and during the winter make a decision- No BMW tech locally that I would want doing this ( may have to get 1 of our Audi techs to help-can possibly borrow the special tools ) Thanks again Wayne
	Appreciate 0 Quote