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      11-03-2015, 09:20 PM   #1
Ryan13
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Track 3.0si Coupe

Just looking for some advise. I already have both an 01 and 06 Mroadster, but want to start doing some track time. I suppose I have the option of converting one of the cars into track, but the 06 is basically new with only 8500 miles and while the 01 has all the Dinan bits for a Stage 3 build, I have not reinforced the rear end. In either case, I'm still in a roadster and limited to what I can participate in.

So I'm looking at picking up a 3.0si coupe. Yes I know the differences, steering, LSD, engine, etc. But I think with the sport version of the coupe and adding a few mods, maybe I could dial out most of the downsides. The other thing that I've noticed in most track videos...unless you are really, really, racing, you're just in a procession going fast around some turns. You can't pass unless you get a point, so I'm trying to figure out why I would need an Mcoupe vs a 3.0.

There are a few people on here tracking, not racing, their cars. Is there really a premium for putting a Mcoupe on the track? Seems like the consumables would be higher (floating brakes vs normal rotor blanks and pads for example) and the overal maintenance would be higher. Plus, the initial investment between the two cars is $10k+.

Is the 3.0 enough?
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      11-04-2015, 02:12 AM   #2
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I haven't tracked my coupe yet so I really dont think I'm qualified to give advice, however I believe 3002 tii does and he seems quite proficient in what it takes to get the 3.0si track ready. I'd suggest hitting him up for advice, or searching for his threads.

With that being said I purchased my 3.0si with the intent to track it and would have to agree with you on all points. The only thing I really would like is an lsd which can be added for far less than the cost to upgrade into an M coupe. We'll see how she does once I actually get her out on the track (too many other priorities in life have kept me away from the cars lately).
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      11-04-2015, 01:18 PM   #3
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How much track experience do you have thus far? I suggest heading to a more laid-back, open track day with either of the Roadster's (some tracks are OK with convertibles not running an aftermarket roll bar). While there try to get some passenger or driver's seat time in other cars and make sure you A) still want to get into tracking and B) think a Z4 coupe is the correct car.

Plenty of fun, reliable track cars to be had in the sub $20K range. If you do decide to go with the Z4, brake rotors, pads and fluid is really all I would do initially.
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      11-04-2015, 02:16 PM   #4
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I believe the "track experience" question is valid...the answer is none.

The Z3M was built up to be a track car by the previous owner...spared no expense and has every imaginable upgrade (3.73, M5 clutch, Dinan suspension, Dinan intake and throttle bodies, Dinan software, Dinan exhaust, sub frame bushings, etc., etc.). I added some of these things and was going to track it, but the one thing the po left out was the rear subframe rebuild. I'm looking at $3-$4k there...but I'm still in a convertible. Then I picked up the Z4MR...totally stock and will not be a track car.

You can immediately tell the Z4 is a better car than the Z3 even with all the upgrades. The Z3 is a faster car and weighs slightly less, but the road holding capabilities of the Z4 is worlds apart. Perhaps if I spend the $4k on the sub-frame, I could get closer to the Z4, but my gut says no way.

I hang around a little with the Thayer crowd here in Virginia and they do some insane stuff to those Z3s, but they are putting FI on the cars and I'm not looking for raw power, I want the balanced performance driving experience. There are a lot of cars out there for less than $20k for sure, the e36M3 and a WRX come to mind outside of the Z4. I think I'm stuck on the Z4 because I really want to stay in the "family".

So I thought the Z4 3.0 would be a good entry point. It has taken me about a year to decide NOT to race the Z3 (it is in pristine condition) and I can't bring myself to abuse the Z4.

I can fine Z4 coupes with the sport package for $15-18. Comparable 50k mile MC are around $25k. Then you get into the consumables. If there really is a difference, then maybe I go for a 75k mile Z4MC and spend $22-23.

Like I said, your question is relevant. I've not tracked any of the cars, so I would like to enter at a reasonable capex and keep the opex low if possible and not feel to bad if I make a mistake on turn 3 (suppose that's the insurance company's problem).

Tracking looks to be a lot like F1...a very fast procession. If you are not passing, then all you really need to do is keep up. I've watched 3002 tii wring the Z4 pretty well and I believe that is enough, but I've also seen posts where everyone would swap up to the M. It's a $10k question in my mind plus higher opex. I can't seem to get past it.
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      11-04-2015, 02:37 PM   #5
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Like I said, your question is relevant. I've not tracked any of the cars, so I would like to enter at a reasonable capex and keep the opex low if possible and not feel to bad if I make a mistake on turn 3 (suppose that's the insurance company's problem).

I've watched 3002 tii wring the Z4 pretty well and I believe that is enough, but I've also seen posts where everyone would swap up to the M. It's a $10k question in my mind plus higher opex. I can't seem to get past it.
Totally understand not wanting to risk it with a well sorted and pristine Z3M or Z4M.

For me the thrill of tracking (my experience is in open days, not wheel-to-wheel racing) is like taking a great drive on your favorite canyon road sans police and speed limits. I take it at 85-90% and try to keep the shiny side up! For this sort of experience it certainly helps to have a car putting down ~250-325 at the wheels and some grunt.

Contrary to popular belief you don't need any specific car or setup to track. Being comfortable with the car, driving position, transmission etc helps focus on the other elements. Strive to improve your own line, shifts and inputs and worry less about keeping up or beating the pack. Once you start sweating lap times, etc. you upgrade the exhaust, tune, brakes, suspension. At that point it's easier to start off at a higher level than upgrade into it (i.e. M over non-M).
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      11-04-2015, 07:49 PM   #6
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I've been tracking my 3.0si for a good 3+ years. Looking back, I have no regrets commiting the car to track use only. If anything, the low cost maintenance of the N52 has made it that much of a better choice for hard driving. Oil changes every 5k, fluids every 20k, bushings every 40k. The only major 'watch out' for on the n52 are oil leaks (valve cover gasket) and water pump/t-stat, both of which are straightforward jobs. But I've yet to hear about any catastrophic engine failure.

Sure it lacks some top end coming down the straight but most of the road courses I frequent aside from Watkins don't have very long straights. Most other times, its powering out of the corners where I wish I had more grunt and that could easily be solved with gearing...

The 'must have' track mods in my opinion are: LSD with shorter gears and suspension/camber (not factoring in track pads or tires since that'd be the case for any street car). With -3*, I have no problem stuffing 255/35 on all 4 corners which will be more than sufficient in providing grip.

I haven't had as much time to do DE's this year but I do plan to start doing Time Attacks next year. Guess I'll have a better feel for how the N52 coupe stacks up compared to its peers.
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      11-04-2015, 11:55 PM   #7
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Good advice here from both B_Dol and 3002 tii.

I'll add my two cents. There are generally two reactions to a first track day: Where do I sign up for the next 6; this isn't for me.

All you really need at this point is fresh brake fluid, pads with 40-50%, an open mind, and a willingness to sign up for an instructed track day. If you like it, do a couple more. Then consider which way to go, whether than be upgrading the current ride, buying a dedicated track car, or upgrading. There's no right answer there either--I started off with a WRX, moved on to the Z4M, then a stripped E36 M3, and I'm on to another tangent now (basically consolidating cars since my available track time with work/family is limited and unpredictable).

Bottom line get to the track and try it. Then worry about the details later.
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      11-05-2015, 11:56 AM   #8
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I'll +1 the get on a track and try it first.

If you do move past that, don't rule out the non-sport package cars though. The differences are:
  • Suspension, that you might be replacing/upgrading--I know it's heavier sways, different springs, maybe differently valved shocks/struts.
  • Sport button -- who cares
  • Sport seats-- this is worthy of some consideration, but may still be installed without the sport package
  • 17 inch wheels -- which you might be replacing with track wheels anyway, but be aware that 17" tires save me around $80/corner when it comes time to replace
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      11-06-2015, 08:33 AM   #9
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I've done a number of PDX/HPDE events with my 3.0si Roadster and the only place where the Z4M makes a difference is as 3002 tii stated on the longer straights where the M will pull away from you. In most cases you'll still be one of the faster cars on the track, and since you really do these events for personal experience and you're not racing wheel to wheel, the 3.0si will provide more than enough challenge for you without the M premium in purchase price or maintenance.
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      11-06-2015, 09:06 AM   #10
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All great questions, I can't count how many different cars I have driven during and HPDE. ANY car out there can be a track-able car if its prepared correctly. I have driven a range of cars from a stock Chevrolet Impala SS, every BMW M3 made, Corvette Z06 track package, Porsche GT3 RS, Z4 coupes, Miatas, Z3 Coupes, Mustangs, and Camaros. You stated you have auto-crossed the roadsters, which is a great start but you will still be a NOVICE student on the track. Some things crossover others do not. Being a BMWCCA HPDE chair I have fought the National congress every 2 years for the past 7 years about allowing convertibles on the track, its NOT going to happen. Until you reach the Intermediate level just about anything is great to learn in. Stock brake pads, standard brake fluids, all work well. Learn the correct lines, learn heal toe, learn to be smooth. All of that works with any car. Your concern about consumables is ok, but do you want to learn how to drive on a track or are you more concerned about what parts you are going to replace, if its the parts, stay away from the track. I learned everything in a E30 M3 and parts are high and rare, but its an amazing track car.
As far as the point by comment, that basically is to keep people SAFE. You do NOT pass in corners, and HPDE is NOT A RACE. There are no trophies for fastest laps, no podium presentation at the end of the weekend.
Please send me a PM if you would like to talk in more detail I would be thrilled to help anyone wanting to learn.
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      11-06-2015, 01:28 PM   #11
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All great questions, I can't count how many different cars I have driven during and HPDE. ANY car out there can be a track-able car if its prepared correctly. I have driven a range of cars from a stock Chevrolet Impala SS, every BMW M3 made, Corvette Z06 track package, Porsche GT3 RS, Z4 coupes, Miatas, Z3 Coupes, Mustangs, and Camaros. You stated you have auto-crossed the roadsters, which is a great start but you will still be a NOVICE student on the track. Some things crossover others do not. Being a BMWCCA HPDE chair I have fought the National congress every 2 years for the past 7 years about allowing convertibles on the track, its NOT going to happen. Until you reach the Intermediate level just about anything is great to learn in. Stock brake pads, standard brake fluids, all work well. Learn the correct lines, learn heal toe, learn to be smooth. All of that works with any car. Your concern about consumables is ok, but do you want to learn how to drive on a track or are you more concerned about what parts you are going to replace, if its the parts, stay away from the track. I learned everything in a E30 M3 and parts are high and rare, but its an amazing track car.
As far as the point by comment, that basically is to keep people SAFE. You do NOT pass in corners, and HPDE is NOT A RACE. There are no trophies for fastest laps, no podium presentation at the end of the weekend.
Please send me a PM if you would like to talk in more detail I would be thrilled to help anyone wanting to learn.
Keep trying though! At some point BMWCCA will hopefully catch up with SCCA, CHIN, PCA, etc. that allow verts so long as they have factory roll over protection. It can be either fixed roll bars like the Z4 has or the pop up system like some of the 3 series have.
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      11-06-2015, 02:37 PM   #12
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Keep trying though! At some point BMWCCA will hopefully catch up with SCCA, CHIN, PCA, etc. that allow verts so long as they have factory roll over protection. It can be either fixed roll bars like the Z4 has or the pop up system like some of the 3 series have.
dc_wright, to be honest it has really nothing to do with SCCA-Chin, PCA and whoever else.
It keeps coming down to safety, and as an instructor I do understand that part. DO (you/me/???) as an instructor really want to be in a convertible without protection if there is a rollover. Nobody would, sure its that 99.99% gamble nothing will happen but its the 0.01% that could end your life. Its just not worth it.
I have a 2006 Z4 M Coupe, i bought that because I knew the roadster was not allowed on the track, yet I think the roadster is far the better looking of the two cars.
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      11-06-2015, 03:42 PM   #13
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dc_wright, to be honest it has really nothing to do with SCCA-Chin, PCA and whoever else.
It keeps coming down to safety, and as an instructor I do understand that part. DO (you/me/???) as an instructor really want to be in a convertible without protection if there is a rollover. Nobody would, sure its that 99.99% gamble nothing will happen but its the 0.01% that could end your life. Its just not worth it.
I have a 2006 Z4 M Coupe, i bought that because I knew the roadster was not allowed on the track, yet I think the roadster is far the better looking of the two cars.
I'm not saying verts without roll over protection should be allowed, just that SCCA, CHIN and others have allowed soft tops with roll bars for some time, while BMWCCA doesn't. In the event of a roll over, I think I'd prefer to be in some well built soft tops with roll bars rather than some tin can hard tops that would be allowed just because the roof is metal, not cloth.
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      11-06-2015, 04:14 PM   #14
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Just like all things in real life...It's complicated (wrt the convertible issue).

There are three basic entities at play here regarding convertibles in HPDE for BMW CCA. One is insurance. And I don't mean insurance for you or your car. I mean the overall policy that covers all CCA events. The hurdle can be crossed, but it would raise BMW CCA insurance policy cost across board for all CCA events. The insurance riders simply do not like the odds of an open top in a high speed environment, period. So while AX (low speed) is acceptable by insurance, HPDE is not. Not at the rates CCA pays, anyway.

Second, CCA instructor corp is older than most of the other organizations. At the last event I attended out here in Pacific Region, about 40% of the instructors are older than 55. About half of the instructors have been instructing for more than 10 years. More than 1/3rd have had more than 15 years of instructing experience. These guys are used to the "old" ways where we never allowed convertibles, they all started instructing in the golden age of BMW CCA HPDEs where they've probably seen a couple of roll overs in their instructing careers, and back in those days, you can imagine a roll-over in a convertible is not something you'd walk away from. So while TODAY's convertibles are probably far safer than say, an E30 M3 in a roll over, you will NEVER convince the vocal 1/3rd of the instructors to get in one. And these are typically the guys who are CIs or tent leaders or the more accomplished instructors in the group. To be honest, I have been asked to sit in the passenger side in convertibles on track before, and even I get a little apprehensive, despite the fact that I used to track my old Z4 3.0i for about half dozen times.

Third, we're dealing with BMW CCA. It is the BIGGEST SINGLE MARQUEE club in the world. Unlike smaller organizations, CCA is not a nimble organization. With hundreds of chapters spread out across the country and tens of thousands of members and constituents, you can imagine the difficulty in getting ANYTHING changed, especially changed from a national level.

All three of these factors, along with a slew of other smaller influencers, make it virtually impossible for BMW CCA to allow convertibles in DEs. You should see what happens at the National Congress and the DEC meetings. You bring up allowing convertibles for HPDEs and watch the fireworks fly. Half the room will argue until they're blue in the face for, and the other half is willing to rip your throat out to argue against, and 3 hours into the "discussion" nothing is resolved.

Hence, no convertibles with BMW CCA HPDEs. Although, I've heard some "rumors" of late, that the rules may be relaxed to allow individual chapters to assume the responsibility to decide whether or not to allow MODER convertibles with factory roll-over protection to participate in DEs. I still don't think it'll happen...But I'm not on anyone's radar for "decision maker" so that's that.
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      11-06-2015, 04:41 PM   #15
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I can't seem to get past it.
I'm going to offer my 2 cents. Take it for what it's worth (2 cents).

I am in the mood for story telling. Long, LONG time ago, I have a bunch of friends that take their BMWs to various local tracks. I've always been fascinated, and every time they broach the topic, I've always told them "next time you guys go, you let me know." But then, next time they asked, I've always had some stupid excuse. "Oh the car needs brakes." "I'm working on a new suspension this weekend." "UCLA is playing [insert bottom feeder team] on Saturday." "Oh is it my anniversary AGAIN? No way."

This went on for about 1.5 years. Until one weekend, out of nowhere, they invited me to go to Vegas. What? Free transportation and room for Vegas? Are you freakin' kidding me? That's my FAVORITE kind of Vegas trip. So after some boozing, some "light" gambling (I did manage to win $500), the next morning they said "hey we're heading over to Las Vegas Motor Speedway. Wanna come?"

This being back in the day when my tolerance for alcohol is as strong as my taste for spicy food (and before you ask, I like spicy food), I gladly said yes despite the light hang-over. While gawking over some of the nice hardware parked at the track, an instructor approached me and asked if I wanted to get a ride. Unbeknownst to me, my buddies were in the back laughing their @sses off, I borrowed one of their helmets and walked up to the pit expecting a new M3 or an M5 to pull up.

Nope. It was an '84 E30. With an Eta engine. Being taught to be polite, I quietly hopped into the car, and as I closed the door, the door handle fell off in my hand. I awkwardly handed the handle to the instructor with a sheepish grin, and he just tosses it out the window. So as we're getting gridded up, it started to rain despite the sun being out. And rain it did...For the first time in ages. In Vegas.

So imagine my chagrin when the instructor still chose to go out on track. In the rain. DRIVING HIS FREAKIN BALLS OFF. First two turns I was holding on for dear life, for those of you that don't know the outer road course at Las Vegas, it is a tight, technical, and very challenging course. By turn 3 my eyes were as big as saucers. By turn 5 he was sliding and counter steering like crazy.

By lap 2 I was freakin' hooked. This is about as much fun as I ever had with my clothes on. The entire time the instructor, while driving his car to the limit, was yammering in my ear, talking like he's just going on a Sunday drive to church. In about 5 laps he pulled in, I got out of the car, and my entire system was flooded with adrenaline and my hands were shaking, not from fear, but from sheer excitement. I did not know that you can actually drive like that. I did not know that a 15 year old chassis with 300,000 miles on the chassis can move like that. I did not know that an E30 can run circles around an E46 M3 like that.

I was hooked. As I shake the hand of the instructor that just gave me the ride, He looked me straight in the eye, smiled, and said "the first hit is free." At first I didn't quite get what he was referencing, but now I know.

They're like drug dealers. They give you your first taste of speed for free. Now you're hooked, and you can't get the need for speed out of your system.

So I went from that first free hit long, LONG time ago, to spending almost $10,000 a year tracking my E46 323Ci, then upgrading to a 350Z, ultimately to my MZ4 Coupe (with a slew of other daily drive thrown in there). Now it's the MZ4 Coupe with GC coils and 275 slicks all around riding on fixed calipers and track pads, constantly searching for that perfect lap and the flood of both adrenaline and ephedrine that comes with knowing you had driven the mother f**k out of the car and hit just about every mark perfectly.

So what's the moral of this story? Just like all my stories, there is none. However, I'd like to point out, that if I had never taken that step and went with those guys to LVMS, I would probably still be telling them "oh UCLA is playing Oregon State this weekend. I can't go."

That and riding with and watching some dude chase down E46 M3s and E39 M5s in a bone stock E30 325e (in the rain) says to me...It doesn't matter if you're driving the 3.0Si or the new M4. You can have fun just the same, and frankly, it's a lot more rewarding to drive a car like the 3.0Si fast, than it is to drive the new M4 fast, on a track.

*To be honest...It's not hard to drive the new M4 fast on the track. You can slap any average joe in that car and it'll make him look like the next Michael Schumaker. And I'm not saying the comatose Michael, the 9 time World Champion Michael.
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      11-13-2015, 03:43 PM   #16
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I didn't disappear...had a few work things pop up this week with work, so been slightly occupied. Thank you all for the replies, offers to help, stories, and opinions.

I am hunting for a car now. I'm comfortable that a Z4 is what I want, I'll let the market decide if it is going to be a 3.0 or M. I've got some time until the beginning of next season to find a ride and sort out any issues. I'll give it to Thayer and let him build up an 3.73 or 3.91 LSD for it and go from there.

I won't flood inboxes with a bunch of questions now, but I can't promise that will be true in 30-60 days. Let you guys know when I find the car.

Again, many thanks. On to the search.
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      11-18-2015, 11:57 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The HACK View Post
I'm going to offer my 2 cents. Take it for what it's worth (2 cents).

I am in the mood for story telling. Long, LONG time ago, I have a bunch of friends that take their BMWs to various local tracks. I've always been fascinated, and every time they broach the topic, I've always told them "next time you guys go, you let me know." But then, next time they asked, I've always had some stupid excuse. "Oh the car needs brakes." "I'm working on a new suspension this weekend." "UCLA is playing [insert bottom feeder team] on Saturday." "Oh is it my anniversary AGAIN? No way."

This went on for about 1.5 years. Until one weekend, out of nowhere, they invited me to go to Vegas. What? Free transportation and room for Vegas? Are you freakin' kidding me? That's my FAVORITE kind of Vegas trip. So after some boozing, some "light" gambling (I did manage to win $500), the next morning they said "hey we're heading over to Las Vegas Motor Speedway. Wanna come?"

This being back in the day when my tolerance for alcohol is as strong as my taste for spicy food (and before you ask, I like spicy food), I gladly said yes despite the light hang-over. While gawking over some of the nice hardware parked at the track, an instructor approached me and asked if I wanted to get a ride. Unbeknownst to me, my buddies were in the back laughing their @sses off, I borrowed one of their helmets and walked up to the pit expecting a new M3 or an M5 to pull up.

Nope. It was an '84 E30. With an Eta engine. Being taught to be polite, I quietly hopped into the car, and as I closed the door, the door handle fell off in my hand. I awkwardly handed the handle to the instructor with a sheepish grin, and he just tosses it out the window. So as we're getting gridded up, it started to rain despite the sun being out. And rain it did...For the first time in ages. In Vegas.

So imagine my chagrin when the instructor still chose to go out on track. In the rain. DRIVING HIS FREAKIN BALLS OFF. First two turns I was holding on for dear life, for those of you that don't know the outer road course at Las Vegas, it is a tight, technical, and very challenging course. By turn 3 my eyes were as big as saucers. By turn 5 he was sliding and counter steering like crazy.

By lap 2 I was freakin' hooked. This is about as much fun as I ever had with my clothes on. The entire time the instructor, while driving his car to the limit, was yammering in my ear, talking like he's just going on a Sunday drive to church. In about 5 laps he pulled in, I got out of the car, and my entire system was flooded with adrenaline and my hands were shaking, not from fear, but from sheer excitement. I did not know that you can actually drive like that. I did not know that a 15 year old chassis with 300,000 miles on the chassis can move like that. I did not know that an E30 can run circles around an E46 M3 like that.

I was hooked. As I shake the hand of the instructor that just gave me the ride, He looked me straight in the eye, smiled, and said "the first hit is free." At first I didn't quite get what he was referencing, but now I know.

They're like drug dealers. They give you your first taste of speed for free. Now you're hooked, and you can't get the need for speed out of your system.

So I went from that first free hit long, LONG time ago, to spending almost $10,000 a year tracking my E46 323Ci, then upgrading to a 350Z, ultimately to my MZ4 Coupe (with a slew of other daily drive thrown in there). Now it's the MZ4 Coupe with GC coils and 275 slicks all around riding on fixed calipers and track pads, constantly searching for that perfect lap and the flood of both adrenaline and ephedrine that comes with knowing you had driven the mother f**k out of the car and hit just about every mark perfectly.

So what's the moral of this story? Just like all my stories, there is none. However, I'd like to point out, that if I had never taken that step and went with those guys to LVMS, I would probably still be telling them "oh UCLA is playing Oregon State this weekend. I can't go."

That and riding with and watching some dude chase down E46 M3s and E39 M5s in a bone stock E30 325e (in the rain) says to me...It doesn't matter if you're driving the 3.0Si or the new M4. You can have fun just the same, and frankly, it's a lot more rewarding to drive a car like the 3.0Si fast, than it is to drive the new M4 fast, on a track.

*To be honest...It's not hard to drive the new M4 fast on the track. You can slap any average joe in that car and it'll make him look like the next Michael Schumaker. And I'm not saying the comatose Michael, the 9 time World Champion Michael.
Hack, Thanks for sharing man, probably the most inspiring piece of writing I've read in the past couple of months, very very nice.. and sums up the introduction to racing perfectly. Thanks again for putting me in those shoes.

Ryan, good luck with your search mate
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      11-27-2015, 12:22 PM   #18
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I already know the direction the answers to this question are likely to take, but let's explore.

Finding a lot of options, but almost all of them are automatics. I understand the GM sourced hydra-matic is actually ok. It sounds like if you put it in manual mode, you can hold the gear thru a turn.

Is the automatic ok for track? Can it hold up to the abuse? I found a really nice 2008 British racing green with sport down in Raleigh and I'm out in Dallas looking at 2 in white. But out of all my search so far, only 4 manuals. There is a grey sport with dream red up in NY with manual, but it looks a little suspect.

I know everyone is going to say manual, and I'm not in any particular hurry. Just curious if anyone has any good experience with the auto.
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      11-27-2015, 04:11 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan13 View Post
I already know the direction the answers to this question are likely to take, but let's explore.

Finding a lot of options, but almost all of them are automatics. I understand the GM sourced hydra-matic is actually ok. It sounds like if you put it in manual mode, you can hold the gear thru a turn.

Is the automatic ok for track? Can it hold up to the abuse? I found a really nice 2008 British racing green with sport down in Raleigh and I'm out in Dallas looking at 2 in white. But out of all my search so far, only 4 manuals. There is a grey sport with dream red up in NY with manual, but it looks a little suspect.

I know everyone is going to say manual, and I'm not in any particular hurry. Just curious if anyone has any good experience with the auto.
You're not likely to find manual 3.0Si. The vast majority of them are ordered by the dealership with automatic to compliment the fact that you can not buy a Z4M Coupe with automatic (thus automatically, no pun intended, removing more than 90% of the buying populace).

I'd be willing to stake my reputation on there being less than 200 manual 3.0Si in all of North America. They're the fabled unicorns. Those that have one, likely ordered one from the factory with a manual. You will have better luck getting an automatic Si and convert it into a manual if you REALLY want manuals.

Or buy an M.

Having said that. I've know a friend who tracked his automatic 330i for nearly a decade. Never really had any issues with it. The late model automatics are reasonably stout, even for track work. And some would even prefer it because you don't have to worry about shifting, which, for a lot of beginners, is an additional layer of complexity to worry about.
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      11-27-2015, 09:44 PM   #20
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Make me an offer on my 3.0si, already track prepped. Just grab your helmet (and HANS) and you're good to go
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      11-30-2015, 09:35 AM   #21
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Did they ever offer a Z4 in British Racing Green?

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      11-30-2015, 09:46 AM   #22
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Did they ever offer a Z4 in British Racing Green?

Steve
Not sure how close it is to BRG, but they did offer a color on the 3.0si (coupe and roadster) called "Deep Green" (color code A43).

Terrific color. If I could just find one FS with a manual, I'd be a happy boy.....
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