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      06-01-2014, 11:10 PM   #1
intoflatlines
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Front Camber Help - E85 M - Stock Suspension

I have a Z4M with stock suspension. It is used for summer weekend cruising and autocross. It is not a daily driver. ~4K miles per year driven. At the beginning of the season I bought new wheels and tires. I have driven 750 street miles, and 2 autocross events (15 runs in total, ~60 seconds per run). Today I pulled off the wheels to change my brake fluid and noticed that the wear on the front tires is noticeably uneven, with a lot of wear on the outside shoulder, hardly any wear on the inside, which of course is expected with stock alignment.

What is stock camber for the front? How much more negative camber can be "gained" without purchasing any parts? To get more negative camber am I required to buy some washers or something, or camber plates? I live near a BMW race shop (Fall-Line Motorsports) so they should be able to do the labor, I'm just trying to get educated before I bring it in...

Thanks in advance!
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      06-02-2014, 12:05 AM   #2
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I believe stock camber is -1.5. You can gain a bit by removing the suspensions alignment pins. .5 if you're lucky. Outside wear is common for those of use that track and autox a lot,
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      06-02-2014, 02:10 AM   #3
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Have a look here.

Discussed in lots of detail, easy to address quite cheaply (20 dollars in parts + alignment).

Last edited by Finnegan; 06-02-2014 at 11:35 AM..
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      06-02-2014, 04:43 PM   #4
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Thanks. I ordered parts from McMaster Carr since they're local, and will have an alignment on Wednesday. Right now I'm thinking -2.5*, zero toe for the fronts, and -2.0*, 0.14 toe in (total) rear. Hopefully that is attainable and a good setup for a weekend cruiser and autocross car.
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      06-02-2014, 06:37 PM   #5
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I think that's fine. Bit more negative in the rear than mine but for a short heavy cornered course it's probably fine.

I like Kgolf's toe setting as it's easier to apply power on corner exit.
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      06-04-2014, 04:01 PM   #6
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Well apparently with 9" ET42 wheels and 245 tires that run wide up front, even one camber washer makes it rub on the strut. Oh well. Spacers or camber plates for me I guess!
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      06-05-2014, 08:12 AM   #7
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Also, the locating pins were already pulled by the previous owner I suppose. But one side is adjusted out, the other is adjusted in... both say they have -1.1* camber though.
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      06-07-2014, 11:50 AM   #8
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I have turner camber kit with stock suspension.
Front -3.0 camber 0 toe
Rear -2.0 camber with very little toe in.
fitted 18x9.5 with 265/35 all around
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      06-07-2014, 04:32 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by intoflatlines View Post
Well apparently with 9" ET42 wheels and 245 tires that run wide up front, even one camber washer makes it rub on the strut. Oh well. Spacers or camber plates for me I guess!
You can probably run a 5mm spacer. We have 245s on 9" with ET37. If you go 10mm spacers, w/o lip, get Turner Hub Extenders. Hubcentric wheels require the lip. I'm a bit OCD about that, so I went with the extenders with a 5mm spacer.
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      06-07-2014, 10:00 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macsubie View Post
I have turner camber kit with stock suspension.
Front -3.0 camber 0 toe
Rear -2.0 camber with very little toe in.
fitted 18x9.5 with 265/35 all around
What offset?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finnegan View Post
You can probably run a 5mm spacer. We have 245s on 9" with ET37. If you go 10mm spacers, w/o lip, get Turner Hub Extenders. Hubcentric wheels require the lip. I'm a bit OCD about that, so I went with the extenders with a 5mm spacer.
yeah if I do spacers I will just do a stud conversion so I can switch spacers without having to worry about extended bolts or anything and also do quick wheel swaps. I might just do camber plates though.
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      06-11-2014, 01:33 PM   #11
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i'm running Apex ec-7 +38 with a 12mm spacer to clear the struts.
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      06-11-2014, 02:02 PM   #12
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Gotcha, so effectively 18x9.5+26. You roll your fenders?
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      06-16-2014, 02:20 AM   #13
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Hi, I did this camber mod a couple of years ago. From memory I fitted four 2mm washers and replaced the existing bolts (might have been M12), with some longer ones as the standard were fairly short and rusty. This gave me enough neg for the track without it being darty on the road. I left the top strut locating pins alone. The biggest expense is getting the tracking done, the parts cost very little! One thing to be VERY careful of though, when fitting longer bolts, make sure they are not too long, obviously! I used Cap machine screws 12.9 rating, but the threads in the upright were a bit rusty where the original bolt didn't reach, and this tightened up the new bolt to stop it fully going in! So I ran a tap in the holes and cleaned out the rust in the thread, it was quite corroded. I know you guys in sunny Socal probably won't have this problem like in the UK, but it might be worth checking anyway if you have some rust? Anyway, I thought it was a very worthwhile mod for very little cost, wish it was always like that!
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      06-20-2014, 01:34 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by intoflatlines View Post
Gotcha, so effectively 18x9.5+26. You roll your fenders?
nope, it doesnt require rolling nor pulling.
cuz it's still stock height hahaha
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      06-20-2014, 02:10 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macsubie View Post
nope, it doesnt require rolling nor pulling.
cuz it's still stock height hahaha
You have pics of the car? Do you have spacers or very low offset on the rear as well? I didn't think 9.5 ET26 would have been doable on the front, maybe in a few years I will try that for a square setup. What tires are you using?
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      06-20-2014, 02:44 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by intoflatlines View Post
You have pics of the car? Do you have spacers or very low offset on the rear as well? I didn't think 9.5 ET26 would have been doable on the front, maybe in a few years I will try that for a square setup. What tires are you using?


I'm using 9.5 +38 all around with 12mm for spacers front and rear, the rear doesn't really need it, but I just put it on so it just complete the square setup and more even tire wear for me to rotate it after every track day
And tires I'm using Dunlop ZII 265/35/18.
First I thought it's not doable too, but it actually fits even with stock alignment and no spacers are needed at the beginning without rubbing too.
I need the spacers to clear the front struts now is because of i'm running -3' up front.

few more pics here for you on my thread
http://www.zpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1000043

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      06-21-2014, 01:20 AM   #17
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Hmm..

So in lieu of camber plates (which would cost ~$400+ installation), it might be feasible for me to do spacers in front without rubbing?

Fronts are BFG Rivals in 245/40/18x9 +42. So if I do 12mm spacers, I'll be at 9" +30. Add the camber washers and I can be at hopefully -2.5 to -3.0 camber, that may be enough to not rub? I could try 5mm spacers instead, but not sure if that will be enough to clear the strut with two washers. My concern is that you are running 265s up front just fine, but those are also with 35 profile tires.
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      07-01-2014, 05:19 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by intoflatlines View Post
Hmm..

So in lieu of camber plates (which would cost ~$400+ installation), it might be feasible for me to do spacers in front without rubbing?

Fronts are BFG Rivals in 245/40/18x9 +42. So if I do 12mm spacers, I'll be at 9" +30. Add the camber washers and I can be at hopefully -2.5 to -3.0 camber, that may be enough to not rub? I could try 5mm spacers instead, but not sure if that will be enough to clear the strut with two washers. My concern is that you are running 265s up front just fine, but those are also with 35 profile tires.
Ya...it really depends on how much camber you will be running
For me, I want to max it out, and the 10mm are just cleared.
I don't think your tires gonna rub if you are on stock suspension. if you are doing -2.5 i think you need at least a 5-8mm spacer.... but it really depends... cause you have high offset wheels....hard to say
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