2008 Z4M Second Gear Grind at Full Stop!?

vipergts450 · 07-17-2011, 05:30 PM

Hi all,

So just to reintroduce myself, I became the proud owner of my 2008 Z4M Roadster a few months ago and have had a great time driving it so far. Wonderful little car and my first so needless to say I'm in love.

Today, however, it did something very odd which I can't explain and was unable to reproduce when deliberately trying to.

I was at a stop light in neutral and prepared for the light to turn green as I normally have for the past three months - clutch fully in, shift to second, slowly release clutch when the light turns green and go.

First question - have I been putting too much strain on the clutch by starting in second? First gear I've found to be too tall and the subsequent 1-2 shift tends to be too jerky for easy driving around the city...

But this aside, I put the car into second with the clutch fully down and as the light turned green I started to ease off the clutch and when I got to the friction point, GRINNDDDDD. Luckily within half a second of hearing it, I slammed the clutch back down, grabbed neutral then second again with a little more force and then was fine.

Is there a known issue with second gear's notch on the gearbox such that it can feel like it's fully engaged and not actually be so? I couldn't replicate it again but I'll update you guys if it happens more....

I know the transmissions on the Z4 Ms have been known to have issues with 1-2 shifts grinding, but I've never heard of it happening when the car is at rest. Tranny mounts issue maybe?

Any advice would be really appreciated.

Endless619 · 07-17-2011, 06:02 PM

Actually I always use 1st gear in my 08 and it takes some practice but first gear is not too tall at all for town/city driving. At least not for me anyway. Very easy and simple.

On your grind issue, I have never heard of it.

Flying Scotsman · 07-17-2011, 08:00 PM

Ok first i don't have a M, but i also find 1st gear on mine very TALL, so unless on a hill or need a quick pull away ALWAYS start off in second and have done in almost all my cars in 25+ years off driving without hurting anything in any off them.
With what you describe, it sounds like the gear wasn't engaged properly (lapse of concentration), hence when you tried the second time, no problem.

RevsPlease · 07-17-2011, 08:09 PM

Sounds like you didn't fully engage the gear and you just ground your synchro a little. Not super bad, but definitely not something you want to be doing every day. Just make sure you pull the stick all the way back and feel the engagement.

BTM · 07-17-2011, 09:20 PM

This thread has the terms short and tall reversed. If you are hesitant to start off in 1st because you've deemed that you end up shifting into second too early for the conditions, your 1st gear is too short, and you start off in 2nd because it is a taller gear.

jason432 · 07-17-2011, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BTM

This thread has the terms short and tall reversed. If you are hesitant to start off in 1st because you've deemed that you end up shifting into second too early for the conditions, your 1st gear is too short, and you start off in 2nd because it is a taller gear.

vogelfanger · 07-18-2011, 06:26 AM

I've gotten grinding noises before when shifting from first to second during hard accelerations. There are a few threads about it - I remember it has to do with the fact that the Z4M uses the 3.0si gearbox, which isn't designed for the S54 power. I don't know how that exactly ties to your situation of starting in second, but I suspect that plays a part somehow. I'd be curious to hear what you find.

EDIT - found link on first to second grind:
http://www.zpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=199942

jragan · 07-18-2011, 08:12 AM

You don't like the jerkiness of the 1->2 shift because you still have the CDV in place. Remove the CDV and you'll be able to shift the car like you actually know how to drive stick. For more information on the CDV and why you should remove it: http://www.zeckhausen.com/CDV.htm

esqu1re · 07-18-2011, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RevsPlease

Sounds like you didn't fully engage the gear and you just ground your synchro a little. Not super bad, but definitely not something you want to be doing every day. Just make sure you pull the stick all the way back and feel the engagement.

I think this is it. Let us know if it happens again; otherwise attribute it to pilot error.

Endless619 · 07-18-2011, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Scotsman

Ok first i don't have a M, but i also find 1st gear on mine very TALL, so unless on a hill or need a quick pull away ALWAYS start off in second and have done in almost all my cars in 25+ years off driving without hurting anything in any off them.
With what you describe, it sounds like the gear wasn't engaged properly (lapse of concentration), hence when you tried the second time, no problem.

In 20 years of driving I have always adapted to the cars I have owned and never had any issues. A Ferrari 360 is much different than an Acura NSX, thus adapting to learn how to drive it. Practice makes perfect...

I have never had any issues with the variety of cars I have owned and driven (starting in 1st gear) from Ferrari's to Honda's....

I am not here to debate but giving you another enthusiasts observation.

Flying Scotsman · 07-18-2011, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EndlessZ4M

In 20 years of driving I have always adapted to the cars I have owned and never had any issues. A Ferrari 360 is much different than an Acura NSX, thus adapting to learn how to drive it. Practice makes perfect...

I have never had any issues with the variety of cars I have owned and driven (starting in 1st gear) from Ferrari's to Honda's....

I am not here to debate but giving you another enthusiasts observation.

When i first read this i thought what you on about, then reread mine, should have been a "I" before "ALWAYS", meaning for the OP not to worry about any damage caused, since i have been pulling away in second for so long,,apologies for the confusion.

vipergts450 · 07-18-2011, 06:20 PM

Thanks all for the bit of reassurance - I was pretty worried that I damaged my baby!! I will definitely be more careful and more deliberate when I engage a gear... I'll be sure to let you know if it repeats, hopefully it won't. How hard do you all tend to pull when you engage second?

And thanks for the feedback; you guys are great.

Also, thanks for the less on the terminology. I guess I had it backwards. The ratio is too high for me thus the gear is too short, right?

07-17-2011, 05:30 PM	#1
vipergts450 New Member 0 Rep 14 Posts Drives: 2008 Z4 M Roadster Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Brooklyn, NY iTrader: (0) Garage List 2008 BMW Z4M Roadster [0.00]	2008 Z4M Second Gear Grind at Full Stop!? Hi all, So just to reintroduce myself, I became the proud owner of my 2008 Z4M Roadster a few months ago and have had a great time driving it so far. Wonderful little car and my first so needless to say I'm in love. Today, however, it did something very odd which I can't explain and was unable to reproduce when deliberately trying to. I was at a stop light in neutral and prepared for the light to turn green as I normally have for the past three months - clutch fully in, shift to second, slowly release clutch when the light turns green and go. First question - have I been putting too much strain on the clutch by starting in second? First gear I've found to be too tall and the subsequent 1-2 shift tends to be too jerky for easy driving around the city... But this aside, I put the car into second with the clutch fully down and as the light turned green I started to ease off the clutch and when I got to the friction point, GRINNDDDDD. Luckily within half a second of hearing it, I slammed the clutch back down, grabbed neutral then second again with a little more force and then was fine. Is there a known issue with second gear's notch on the gearbox such that it can feel like it's fully engaged and not actually be so? I couldn't replicate it again but I'll update you guys if it happens more.... I know the transmissions on the Z4 Ms have been known to have issues with 1-2 shifts grinding, but I've never heard of it happening when the car is at rest. Tranny mounts issue maybe? Any advice would be really appreciated.
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07-17-2011, 06:02 PM	#2
Endless619 DHS 203 Rep 4,009 Posts Drives: 2023 M4, 2020 Land Rover Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Disneyland iTrader: (14) Garage List 2014 Range Rover Ev ... [0.00] 2006 Acura TL [0.00]	Actually I always use 1st gear in my 08 and it takes some practice but first gear is not too tall at all for town/city driving. At least not for me anyway. Very easy and simple. On your grind issue, I have never heard of it. __________________ 2020 Land Rover Velar Autobiography 2023 BMW M4 2016 X3
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07-17-2011, 08:00 PM	#3
Flying Scotsman Private First Class 3 Rep 146 Posts Drives: BMW Z4 2.5L Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Long Island N.Y. iTrader: (0)	Ok first i don't have a M, but i also find 1st gear on mine very TALL, so unless on a hill or need a quick pull away ALWAYS start off in second and have done in almost all my cars in 25+ years off driving without hurting anything in any off them. With what you describe, it sounds like the gear wasn't engaged properly (lapse of concentration), hence when you tried the second time, no problem.
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07-17-2011, 08:09 PM	#4
RevsPlease Private First Class 10 Rep 167 Posts Drives: 2003 Z4 3.0i, Black Saphire Join Date: May 2011 Location: Portland, Oregon iTrader: (0) Garage List 2003 BMW Z4 3.0i [10.00]	Sounds like you didn't fully engage the gear and you just ground your synchro a little. Not super bad, but definitely not something you want to be doing every day. Just make sure you pull the stick all the way back and feel the engagement.
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07-17-2011, 09:20 PM	#5
BTM Banned 483 Rep 10,309 Posts Drives: A///MERICAN!!! Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: A///MERICA!!! iTrader: (11) Garage List 2007 BMW Z4 M Coupe [7.20]	This thread has the terms short and tall reversed. If you are hesitant to start off in 1st because you've deemed that you end up shifting into second too early for the conditions, your 1st gear is too short, and you start off in 2nd because it is a taller gear.
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07-18-2011, 06:26 AM	#7
vogelfanger Private First Class 6 Rep 126 Posts Drives: 08 M Roadster Join Date: May 2009 Location: MA iTrader: (0)	I've gotten grinding noises before when shifting from first to second during hard accelerations. There are a few threads about it - I remember it has to do with the fact that the Z4M uses the 3.0si gearbox, which isn't designed for the S54 power. I don't know how that exactly ties to your situation of starting in second, but I suspect that plays a part somehow. I'd be curious to hear what you find. EDIT - found link on first to second grind: http://www.zpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=199942
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07-18-2011, 08:12 AM	#8
jragan Imola Lover 26 Rep 749 Posts Drives: 2007 Imola Red M Coupe Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Fort Worth, Texas iTrader: (0)	You don't like the jerkiness of the 1->2 shift because you still have the CDV in place. Remove the CDV and you'll be able to shift the car like you actually know how to drive stick. For more information on the CDV and why you should remove it: http://www.zeckhausen.com/CDV.htm __________________ His: RIP-"Ruby" *E86 ///M Coupe: Pics Track Pics Short Vids Long Vids Hers: 997-1 C4S*: Pics
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07-18-2011, 06:20 PM	#12
vipergts450 New Member 0 Rep 14 Posts Drives: 2008 Z4 M Roadster Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Brooklyn, NY iTrader: (0) Garage List 2008 BMW Z4M Roadster [0.00]	Thanks all for the bit of reassurance - I was pretty worried that I damaged my baby!! I will definitely be more careful and more deliberate when I engage a gear... I'll be sure to let you know if it repeats, hopefully it won't. How hard do you all tend to pull when you engage second? And thanks for the feedback; you guys are great. Also, thanks for the less on the terminology. I guess I had it backwards. The ratio is too high for me thus the gear is too short, right?
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