Dare I swap the z4mc for an older 911 targa?

[fatmatt0116]

Got a call from the local porsche dealership today. They have a 2002 Silver 911 Targa 6 speed with some 20k on it, priced in the low 30s and CPO. I am going Saturday to inspect. Thoughts? Will post pics after the test drive.

[david_lm]

I'd definitely keep the Z4MC. Probably way more fun to drive.

[skim]

i'm a porsche fan, but ain't no 996 fan..

[epbrown]

Originally Posted by fatmatt0116

Got a call from the local porsche dealership today. They have a 2002 Silver 911 Targa 6 speed with some 20k on it, priced in the low 30s and CPO. I am going Saturday to inspect. Thoughts? Will post pics after the test drive.

For some people, getting a Porsche is an itch that never goes away; for others (like myself), a bit of scratching cures it pretty much for good. If you've always wanted one and haven't tried it yet, I'd say go ahead and get it over with. They're very nice, and it might be just the car for you.

[nmulax]

I'm actually a fan of the 996; but not a Targa person myself, so I'd say pass.
Let us know how the test drive goes.

[shitbrownMcoupe]

993 or 997, and I wouldn't go Targa if you wanna track.

Daily driver, go for it. But I'd keep both the MC and the Porsche

[AWM3]

Stay away from any 996. They are sort of the equivalent of the 74-77 911s which were interim models between the early desirable cars up to 73 and the 78 and later cars which had most of the problems sorted out. If you're too young to relate to that bit of history, just take my word for it. 996=bad. 993 or 997=good. The 993 Targa is a very nice car, but probably at least $10K more than the car you are looking at. That should tell you something right there.

[The HACK]

Originally Posted by fatmatt0116

Got a call from the local porsche dealership today. They have a 2002 Silver 911 Targa 6 speed with some 20k on it, priced in the low 30s and CPO. I am going Saturday to inspect. Thoughts? Will post pics after the test drive.

'02? That would be the 996? They're practically dime a dozen. Low 30s would be a boat load of profit for the dealer. My co-worker just picked up a similar car with 35K miles for $29K out the door, and the dealer even threw in a spare set of rims.

[Huz-Z]

I hate to repeat rumors, but I have heard it said that certain Porsche cars are prone to catostrophic engine failure due to the intermediate shaft coming apart and destroying the engine.

I have no first-hand knowledge of this, only what I've seen in posts from other folks and a quick look at this site: WWW.Porscheenginefailure.com .

I would hate like hell to see you buy a dream car and have it become a nightmare.

[The HACK]

I hate to repeat rumors too, but I heard the S54 in the MZ4 is prone to dropping a cam-bolt down the engine and causing catastrophic engine failures too, as well as having some serious problems with engine mounts (okay, this second part is actually quite true in that the numbers of failed engine mount bolts is shockingly high for the limited production).

Actually the "big" problem with the 996 non-GT(x) engines, as well as the boxster and Cayman, is the rear main seal.

[M_Six]

Test drove a 2002 911 coupe before I bought the Z4. I wanted it in the worst way, but couldn't come to an agreement with the dealer. I wasn't thrilled about the color combo, but the car was a joy to drive. Still, the Z is every bit as fun and it's a drop-top to boot. Today was upper 70s and sunny. The ride home was pure joy today.

If you can swing an extended test drive in the Porsche, take advantage. It's going to be a tough call, but the decision making process should be a ball.

[GothM]

Don't do it.

[Huz-Z]

Originally Posted by shift@red

Honestly man...you need to stop saying this. While its has been a problem, its not as bad as you seem to make it. You havnt even owned a 996. I have owned a 996 911, and my father owned many including a couple 996 911 Turbos...and we had no problems with this issue or the RMS issue.
I could come on here and talk about the rod bearing issues BMW has had with the S54, which was more wide-spread than the P car issue, so much so there was a service bulletin/recall on them. Theres also the rear sub-frame issue which there was a class action lawsuit against bmw for. Or should i go on to talk about smg transmission failures in M cars?
Every car has problems...but think about this, Porsche's are now ranked as #1 in reliability (and i believe also in initial quality) while BMW is behind the industry average and quite frankly need to step up their quality/fit/finish/materials in their cars as they have fallen behind.

With all due respect, when I post using words like "I hate to repeat rumors", "I have heard" or "I have no first-hand knowledge", I think its pretty clear that I'm presenting information of questionable reliability.

As you say, these incidents may be very over-stated in their frequency and I do not doubt your information on the reliability of recent Porsche products. However, anyone considering buying a used Porsche shoud at least be aware of the allegations about the relaibility of certain cars, investigate them, and make up their own mind in a fully informed manner.

After all, we are all car fans and I salute you whatever make is parked in your driveway. But it would certainly be inappropriate to withhold information, questionable as it may (or may not) be from one of our buddies here.

[epbrown]

Originally Posted by The HACK

I hate to repeat rumors too, but I heard the S54 in the MZ4 is prone to dropping a cam-bolt down the engine and causing catastrophic engine failures too, as well as having some serious problems with engine mounts (okay, this second part is actually quite true in that the numbers of failed engine mount bolts is shockingly high for the limited production).

I don't recall any engine mount bolts resulting in someone needing to replace an engine. Hell, mine failed and I didn't get one.

The IMS and RMS issues are real, and more expensive; they just aren't as prevalent as the internet would have you believe - Porsche sold a crap-load of 986/996 cars, and the percentage of cars with these failures is estimated at under 5%, lst I read. In buying a used car, I'd say the odds are higher that the PO did something to screw up the car over this happening, and that could happen with any car.

[fatmatt0116]

Raining today. Test drive delayed. Spec wise, aside from the targa top, I feel as though this would be a down grade and would not be nearly as unique as the z4m c.

[Finnegan]

I don't think I'd make that switch. I recently drove a Cayman (non S) and a 08 Carrera. The Carrera was rather disappointing....Here's my opinion for what little it's probably worth. Just go drive the P car--you'll never be happy until you try it--and if it's your bag then great, my opinion isn't the one that matters.

The Carrera (base, not S) had 335 HP and 275 foot pounds of torque--so it's about the same as the ///M (///M has a higher redline though). I didn't like it! In fact, if I had to pick Carrera over a plain Cayman (and there were no ///M) I'd take the "underpowered" Cayman. The Carrera's front end felt "light" and it felt like one of the front wheels was bouncing or not fully connected to the road on hard cornering (in corners with bumps especially). It felt like the reverse of driving my Integra.... I took the same road I drove the Cayman (so I knew the road, which you'd think would help), and had to drive about 5 MPH slower on it. This car didn't inspire confidence like the Cayman, and I couldn't use the extra power or LSD to my advantage, and I found the balance of the car disconcerting. I was very disinclined to try and rotate the car with the throttle--something I'm happy to do in the ///M.

I expect it takes more time to fully extract the performance the Carrera to learn to deal with the disadvantageous weight distribution, but why bother? After driving both the Carrera and Cayman I got back into the ///M and it immediately put a grin back on my face! The ///M is so unique and rare--and I actually get a lot of P car guys asking me about it and who think it's pretty sweet! Bottom line: Go drive the Targa or even a newer version and see what you think. Like I said before, that's all that really matters.

[AtoB]

old car... old crap interior.

[fatmatt0116]

I kind of feel like anything less than a single turbo 911 will be a waste of my time and $. I have always had a soft spot for the targa tops for some reason, hence my current interest.

[pokeybritches]

BMW fixed the common issues with the S54, and paid for the work to be done. Sure there were probably some unlucky people in the beginning that suffered and had to battle with BMW to pay for it/issue a recall, but Porsche still refuses to fix known problems with early 996s.

http://www.total911.com/news/996-eng...ou-be-worried/

5-10% of 1998-2000 3.4L 911s are affected, and Porsche will not pay to have the problem fixed. The unlucky few will end up spending at least $10k out of pocket, and closer to $18k if they want a new engine installed with a warranty. How many of us experienced a catastrophic engine failure that BMW has refused to fix?

There's a difference between repeating rumors, and bringing up important points that may require further research because the author doesn't have the firsthand experience. If I was looking at a 996 I'd want to know about this "rumor," even if it doesn't pertain to the 2001+ 996s.

[Dammmittt]

Glad you're seeing the light. 997 GT2 or nothing for me

[Finnegan]

Originally Posted by shift@red

Driving a 911 is something one needs to learn before going out and putting down the lap times they are capable, but that can be said of any car. Thing about it is, once youve learned to drive a 911 tha t has some of the best of every performance aspect out there, and the best steering feel out there, it is probably the most rewarding car to drive.
My oppinions on the cars mimick nearly the exact opposite of your sentiments, especially since ive been able to experience even the new Carrera S and GT3 to the fullest, where BMW has nothing that comes remotely close to the GT3 especially, nor do more than one or two manufacturers out there. It is an absolutely jaw dropping, awe inspiring experience that tantilizes every sense and does so with scaple-like precision.
Everyone has different tastes, so buy what you like OP.

RE: the bold quote above: that's the bottom line--which we both are in total agreement about. Like I said before, the OP should go drive the Targa, then decide.

RE: the new GT3 or even previous generation GT3--I am in no way saying the any BMW or the Cayman come anywhere close to it. I didn't drive the GT3....Overall, it's pretty much a given that the 911 requires driver adjustment, and getting the most of of the car requires time, effort, and practice.

All I'm just saying the Carrera didn't blow my socks off as feeling instantly "superior" to the Cayman or ///M. Once you learn to extract the car's true performance capabilities with seat/track time I'm sure the car's true capabilities would shine through. But for the money, I wouldn't spend that much on a regular Carrera (non S, not GT3) vs. a Cayman S or ///M. GT3? If it were priced anywhere near the same that would be a no brainer: GT3. Carrera S, probably a no brainer too.

Of course none of this has to do with the OP's dilemma, and your advice in bold is what matters in that case....

[krnnerdboy]

I traded a 997.1 for my e85m only b/c I made I a profit on the transaction, and the e85m has turned out to be the longest car I have kept in my fleet I would most likely pick up a cayman over the carrera though