Advice Needed: Cracked Block and Piston Head

[Vanne]

That's good mate, sometimes just keepin on is enough for a little while. Let us know when things start rolling. Fingers crossed for ya that it all works out.

[Arsonism]

Too true, I really want it to and I'm scared that it won't. I've posted here in frustration believing that it might not and that I truly should give up hope. I'm holding onto what I have left and the few miles that I've gotten in between. I'll bug the machinist and the shop and see what I can come up with. I'm worried they're going to pull the rug out from underneath me, but hopefully I can cover that base here soon.

Things are coming together here in Austin (my home town) now that I'm back and I think I'll be able to move forward on everything soon. They quoted me the end of May to have the motor mostly reassembled and back in the car as they're moving shops and don't want to have to transplant a ton of parts here and there. I'm not sure that it's going to happen given we are waiting on the machine shop, but we'll see. Keepin my head up as much as I can.

[Finnegan]

Originally Posted by Arsonism

Too true, I really want it to and I'm scared that it won't. I've posted here in frustration believing that it might not and that I truly should give up hope. I'm holding onto what I have left and the few miles that I've gotten in between. I'll bug the machinist and the shop and see what I can come up with. I'm worried they're going to pull the rug out from underneath me, but hopefully I can cover that base here soon.

Things are coming together here in Austin (my home town) now that I'm back and I think I'll be able to move forward on everything soon. They quoted me the end of May to have the motor mostly reassembled and back in the car as they're moving shops and don't want to have to transplant a ton of parts here and there. I'm not sure that it's going to happen given we are waiting on the machine shop, but we'll see. Keepin my head up as much as I can.

Hang in there. If your not going the legal route then be as persistent as possible and as nice as possible. Daily follow up, but friendly. Tip from my dad there--he has always been very nice but persistent, and it was amazing what he'd get people to do (95 and still at it too). Glaciers move slowly but are unstoppable and very powerful. But they move a little each day. Be glacial.

And keep a log and records--no need to disclose but keep and retain.

[DEG]

Originally Posted by Finnegan

Hang in there. If your not going the legal route then be as persistent as possible and as nice as possible. Daily follow up, but friendly. Tip from my dad there--he has always been very nice but persistent, and it was amazing what he'd get people to do (95 and still at it too). Glaciers move slowly but are unstoppable and very powerful. But they move a little each day. Be glacial.

And keep a log and records--no need to disclose but keep and retain.

Finnegan,
Great advice and great analogy.

[Arsonism]

Originally Posted by Finnegan

Hang in there. If your not going the legal route then be as persistent as possible and as nice as possible. Daily follow up, but friendly. Tip from my dad there--he has always been very nice but persistent, and it was amazing what he'd get people to do (95 and still at it too). Glaciers move slowly but are unstoppable and very powerful. But they move a little each day. Be glacial.

And keep a log and records--no need to disclose but keep and retain.

Originally Posted by DEG

Finnegan,
Great advice and great analogy.

I have to agree with DEG here, that truly is a great analogy. Some folks have asked me how I've made it through all of the things that have occurred since embarking down this path of events, and I'd have to say that patience and persistence have definitely been my course of action. It's difficult to explain to others outside of cliche terms that people mostly find empty like "kill them with kindness" and a few other varying common place terms. I haven't gone to the extent of calling them everyday simply because they are waiting on another shop (the machine shop) to wrap up their work and we weren't even supposed to get seen for some time as the shop is really backed up, he's trying to do us a favor since the other two machinists know one another.

I have called every MWF whenever we were working through what we were trying to do and what he was trying to get together. Also just to see if he had started work on the car. It took about a month and a half before everything was broken down and sent off, he proclaimed that he had other work to go through before he could really start on mine. For the most part things worked out even with the delay, although I would have preferred things would have gotten started right away so that I knew what I would be doing with the vehicle, it's still been nice to have a slightly larger vehicle for the time period that I've recently gone through (moving back to home from living with my now ex girlfriend).

I have to say that there is a ton that can be learned from the situation and that's what I focus on the most. Although I'm scared that things won't come out as they should, I'm more comfortable now that I'm in Austin (where the car is being repaired) and that I'm able to go by there a couple times to see how things are being handled and the car is being stored. There's just another peace of mind sort of aspect to be in the same town that the car is being overhauled in, as in if something goes wrong I should be able to get the car there no problem and things should be handled pretty easily from there. Some points still aren't available to me, the warranty and other information hasn't reached me, regardless of how many times I've asked. I'm still unsure of what is going back into the vehicle and I do not know what is legally and ethically correct for them to attempt to repair the rest of my vehicle with, and they proclaim that some parts are better than my parts as they have been "worn-in" and would progressively make more horsepower more quickly (however I don't argue that this would be true, but my WHP isn't what I'm focused on at this point, and that's been expressed to them extensively). I will probably still be looking into what's going back into the car, but I still don't believe we've moved forward from where I've been, other than getting the damaged parts to the machinist (new) and waiting to see how they come back (with spec sheets in hand this time).


I have to say I can't thank you enough for your advice and counsel moving through all of this, it's given me more confidence to speak up on my behalf when things haven't gone as I've felt they should. That's something that is very difficult for me to do as I truly do avoid confrontation. I rarely ever get mad or frustrated, it's mostly shown in the form of disappointment and this doesn't always relay as the customer. As the owner of something or as you're leading an operation, those emotions are clear, but to as a customer it's a little more difficult to express that through the limited interaction they might perceive. Either that or it's them trying not to acknowledge that so that they may get through this on their terms opposed to my own; that's where my greatest fears exist. Regardless, your advice has been impeccable and I can't thank you enough for your kind words as I continue to work through this.

Thank you.

[Arsonism]

I can't believe it's been a little over another month...

Just to put things into perspective, tonight will mark the 315th day (10 months, 1 week and 2 days) that I've been without the M Coupe.

I still don't have any information on the car past what I've already received. The shop has moved into their new space, and my parts were moved with it. I don't know anything from the machine shop, and I haven't had a whole lot of time with the new job trying to figure out where everything sits.

I've now used 4 cars, 1 from my uncle for a short while (after not having a car for quite some time) and 3 different loaner cars... where two from the shop have broken down (more or less, one coolant hose and a cracked window regulator in rainy weather).

I can't say my spirits are high, and I'm terrified to hear news back at all. I'd go out on a limb to say that's subconsciously why I haven't been actively trying to call them. This next week I'll likely try to dig up more, as always, I'll keep y'all posted.

Photos of the new shop area.



[url=https://flic.kr/p/HTAaAd]

[url=https://flic.kr/p/H7xPdp]

[Beedub]

it may be painful but its time to push these guys....

So so so disappointed this turned out this way for you.

[inTgr8r]

^ I agree, sounds like you need to be a squeaky wheel.
Sorry, I lost track of where things stood with this.
I assumed that things were well sorted by now.
It sucks that it has taken so long.

[Steeler]

+1 Beedub and Intgr8r.

The shop has no lack of high end clientele judging from the vehicles in the shop.
You need to absolutely get on their backs and demand a schedule of when they will start working on your car and when they plan on finishing it.
You need to make them accountable. They have no intention of working on your car if you do not speak up.

[Arsonism]

Originally Posted by Beedub

it may be painful but its time to push these guys....

So so so disappointed this turned out this way for you.

Thanks buddy, that's most of what I've held for this hold situation, just pure disappointment. It feels like every time I try to do the right thing here, it ends up worse.

Originally Posted by inTgr8r

^ I agree, sounds like you need to be a squeaky wheel.
Sorry, I lost track of where things stood with this.
I assumed that things were well sorted by now.
It sucks that it has taken so long.

The motor is still sitting with the "new" machine shop whom I don't know the name of. I have been hard pressed to actually try to find and reach out to him to see what he feels is going on with the block. The delays I feel like could be due to just pure fear of eating the cost of whatever comes back and working through whatever else there is left.

Originally Posted by dbarton62

+1 Beedub and Intgr8r.

The shop has no lack of high end clientele judging from the vehicles in the shop.
You need to absolutely get on their backs and demand a schedule of when they will start working on your car and when they plan on finishing it.
You need to make them accountable. They have no intention of working on your car if you do not speak up.

They have had a couple of pretty nice cars come through, but I see where you could determine that, this wasn't the entire shop however, yet I'm not nearly as experienced as y'all are with such judgement. This is the first "high end" car and repair that I've really gone through.

They've given me some deadlines for the car, they thought that they were going to have the motor back about two weeks ago and they would have had most of it back into the car (and close to running) by the end of last month. That clearly hasn't happened however.

I have a hard time holding them accountable as the story that I receive is that we are waiting on someone else (the machine shop) to complete their work before they can complete the rest of it. Everything else is there and ready to go, aside from the tune, which I have to reach out and apologize to Randy from Epic about whenever we do get this whole thing knocked out. Anyways, I'm not sure that I can press the issue or how to press the issue when the hold up is in the hands of a third party, if you have any suggestions, I'm all ears.

Thanks for all the support guys, y'all have gotten me through this in more ways than y'all know and I really appreciate it.

[Vanne]

Shane, don't worry about Randy, he will be cool mate, I've left him hanging for 6 months or so before getting back to him with results, RL happenens. He's a pro mate.
Thanks for updating the thread mate, i was kinda hoping to see some more progress, after they completed their garage move.

all in good time, and hopefully this time done right. I am kinda starting to understand on how your feeling a little bit, haven't seen my car now for over a month myself..

[Arsonism]

Glad to hear that about Randy, I would hate to upset such an outstanding business man.

It's rough, just think if you multiplied that month by 10!

I tried pushing a little bit, but apparently the mechanic that's leading my repair is out until Thursday and he's the only one who is in touch with the machine shop. Not sure if I should press the issue, or if I should just hang tight. Thinking about just leading with the latter.

I should be getting orders here soon to leave out July 7th-29th and then I'll be gone again in August from 5-6 through the 30th I believe. Upside is that on Labor Day I should get to drive an LP450 up in Dallas! No idea how I'm going to manage the shop while away with military duty however.

[Arsonism]

Called in today, main mechanic still hadn't gotten back in. They deferred me to an answer/timeline for tomorrow morning.

They told me that they would have an answer Friday... but two weeks ago. I'll keep y'all posted on what I'm looking at going forward.

[NickyC]

After going through the nightmare of this thread, selling my Z4M and looking into an 08-10 Viper convertible is looking more and more likely for me. 600hp, no rod bearing issues, no VANOS, no worries (that V10 is a tank!). Sure the Viper sounds like a UPS truck going down the street, but it's as fast as nearly anything on the road and a good example can be had for high 40s right now (all are low miles too!). Bone stock 11 second car, some have even seen high 10s.

My Z4M has been flawless in two years of ownership, but I have to admit I hear that damned clock ticking in the back of my head.

Once again, best of luck with your car. Nobody should have to go through this.

[dc_wright]

Originally Posted by Arsonism

I have a hard time holding them accountable as the story that I receive is that we are waiting on someone else (the machine shop) to complete their work before they can complete the rest of it. Everything else is there and ready to go, aside from the tune, which I have to reach out and apologize to Randy from Epic about whenever we do get this whole thing knocked out. Anyways, I'm not sure that I can press the issue or how to press the issue when the hold up is in the hands of a third party, if you have any suggestions, I'm all ears.

Really feel your pain here as I have a good friend who just went though the same thing. Took some legal action to get her car released by the shop and a deputy with a court order in hand to get them to turn it over to her. Hopefully this will turn out much better!

On the "third party being out of their control", unless you steered them to the machine shop, that shop is their subcontractor and they are FULLY responsible for their performance. I many times have wished I could have immunity from the performance of my subs, but unfortunately it doesn't work that way.

[Arsonism]

Originally Posted by NickyC

My Z4M has been flawless in two years of ownership, but I have to admit I hear that damned clock ticking in the back of my head.

Once again, best of luck with your car. Nobody should have to go through this.

I appreciate the condolences as always. I think if I had known that the end result was going to be nearly double the original cost of the repair I would have gone a different route. Also knowing that I would be sunk into this investment without a product for several months past the due date, I would have also reconsidered.

Ultimately, the emotional turmoil of having to work with a shop who doesn't want to work with you because of the incidents at hand is far worse than either of the two items mentioned above. There's just pushing forward at this point... and I really hope that the end result is achievable.

What is the best way to protect yourself from third party vendors/work? Is there something I should be doing currently? I've already been through one machine shop with this shop that says that they performed all the work correctly and then this shop claims that they didn't provide proper measurements, but something like a crank not being round is hardly just a small detail one would overlook when going through all of this work. I have no idea what to think about most all of this.

Originally Posted by dc_wright

Really feel your pain here as I have a good friend who just went though the same thing. Took some legal action to get her car released by the shop and a deputy with a court order in hand to get them to turn it over to her. Hopefully this will turn out much better!

On the "third party being out of their control", unless you steered them to the machine shop, that shop is their subcontractor and they are FULLY responsible for their performance. I many times have wished I could have immunity from the performance of my subs, but unfortunately it doesn't work that way.

I'm on the verge of legal... I spoke with them today about getting the update that they mentioned I would receive last Friday. They informed me today that the shop would have something early this week. I remain skeptical, but that's just a proper emotion at this point I feel like. I want to hold them more accountable but I really don't know what I can do other than push them for deadlines with legal documentation, and that just feels as though it will piss them off and yield a poor end product. I'm still very scared that the parts that they are going to be using are not the originals and I'm very terrified that the block will not be the part that I paid for (whether it's damaged or replaced).

All in all, I'm living life without the Zed and that in itself is sad, regardless of all the drama that hides behind getting her back.

[David70]

I would essentially tell them what you have said to us. Have all of the dates and details, tell them you would like to work this out in a reasonable manner but you need a written timeline (or at least some type of timeline and a completion date) of when they expect things to happen, weekly updates (not "there is only one person that can call the machine shop and he isn't here until next week") and run it like Project Manager. Then tell them if they aren't willing to move forward in a reasonable manner then they aren't leaving you with a lot of options and you will have to look into these options and go forward with them. I wouldn't bring up "lawyer" unless it has to come to it.

As long as they are looking at two jobs, one with a paying customer and one with you (not paying) you will more than likely end up being the one pushed out unless they think the alternative from you is worse than doing the work.

If they don't move forward you may have to move forward with legal action, I would try to avoid it if possible but at the same time at least there is likely to be some type of outcome from it.

[pokeybritches]

I would be tempted to move forward with legal action. It's been far too long.

[Arsonism]

Originally Posted by David70

I would essentially tell them what you have said to us. Have all of the dates and details, tell them you would like to work this out in a reasonable manner but you need a written timeline (or at least some type of timeline and a completion date) of when they expect things to happen, weekly updates (not "there is only one person that can call the machine shop and he isn't here until next week") and run it like Project Manager. Then tell them if they aren't willing to move forward in a reasonable manner then they aren't leaving you with a lot of options and you will have to look into these options and go forward with them. I wouldn't bring up "lawyer" unless it has to come to it.

As long as they are looking at two jobs, one with a paying customer and one with you (not paying) you will more than likely end up being the one pushed out unless they think the alternative from you is worse than doing the work.

If they don't move forward you may have to move forward with legal action, I would try to avoid it if possible but at the same time at least there is likely to be some type of outcome from it.

I agree with the highlighted statement to the very end... I really don't want to change the relationship with the shop because I feel it will reflect negatively in the work that they're doing for me and possibly in future work as well (warranty work, god forbid that it comes to that).

I like the idea of a written timeline, and given the fact that they told me sometime that early this week they would have an answer from the shop, it will be overly appropriate to demand that in writing.

Originally Posted by pokeybritches

I would be tempted to move forward with legal action. It's been far too long.

This temptation is not lost, seeing as it feels I won't have my car back for literally a full year since it's been down... I'm coming up fast on it, and I even if it is repaired I won't have a maiden voyage for it (as I'll be gone at military schools and training) until the M Coupe does make it's way out of the shop. However, keeping them on track and holding them accountable is of the utmost importance at this point, as it's nearly reaching a point of disrespect it seems. There have been far too many deadlines not met.

I think should this "regime" of getting a timeline together fails, at that point the L word will be introduce... unfortunately in this relationship I'm not referring to love.

[Vanne]

Shane, i concur mate.. Just make sure you get some legal advise before threatening the garage, make sure you know where you stand.

[pokeybritches]

Make sure you document everything. Get emails when you can. Any sort of written correspondence helps. You may not even have to threaten legal action. The shop will take notice once you start demanding everything in writing.

Tell them from this point forward, you want everything documented, as they have failed to meet timelines in the past, and you're approaching a year without your car. "It's nothing personal, but I have to cover my own interests, and the slipping timelines have me concerned." Have a course of action if they refuse to put things in writing, and do not back down from this demand.

You're going to keep getting batted around until you reach a breaking point, and neither you nor the shop will like it when you snap.

[Vanne]

+1 what Pokey said.