Paint clarification help please!

[r4gs]

This ought to be in the exterior/cosmetics section, but am having a clear coat peeling issue with my front bumper that i just noticed yesterday evening while handwashing my car.

I've visited my trusted local bodyshop to get a professional opinion, and the boss was asking if my car's ever been resprayed. I need a favor please - if u could pop ur hoods and inspect the front side fenders, where the actual metal piece is bolted onto the frame of the car itself, are these panels painted 100% completely or is there a noticeable line/layer where the paint color stops and there is only primer/base coat (like my photos below)?

I have attached photos of my clear coat predicament and the area i'm asking a favor of fellow z owners to have a look at. Car is still under original warranty and has CPO, so hoping they will fix this under warranty.

[inTgr8r]

^That looks like overspray to me.
I have never heard of anyone with factory clear coat issues.

[r4gs]

i did a search on these forums and a couple of 1-series folks have had the same issue, front bumper as well. i also notice a more pronounced 'orange peel' effect on the front bumper as compared with the hood and front fenders.

i do need to know if ur car's panels are painted in the same way as mine shown above!?

[dekaliber]

Originally Posted by r4gs

i did a search on these forums and a couple of 1-series folks have had the same issue, front bumper as well. i also notice a more pronounced 'orange peel' effect on the front bumper as compared with the hood and front fenders.

i do need to know if ur car's panels are painted in the same way as mine shown above!?

My car is black, so the inside is black too, so I can't help you there. My impression was that the strut towers on the inside are generally the same color as the exterior (sans clear) on BMWs, but maybe that's different for the Z4s.

This picture appears similar to yours: http://www.rfdm.com/gallery/album57/IMG_7039

The orange peel texture (and often, the actual color) on plastic and metal is not going to be exactly the same, even from the factory, due to the different static properties of the two materials. More info here: http://www.autobodysupply.net/Articles.asp?ID=140

That said, if you bought your car CPO/used, there is a very good chance that the bumper was reprayed to fix rock chips.

[rps]

Just went to the garage to look at mine and the portion of the fender in the engine compartment and strut towers are all body color.

[r4gs]

thank u dekaliber and rps for ur responses. per the link to what i can tell was a brand new interlagos blue z4m in the album, the front side fender panels are painted in exactly the same way as mine are. a relief as i was suspicious of any panel work done, paint or otherwise, that may have precluded accident damage or such.

i'd given a call to the dealership i purchased cpo from in houston, and the sales and service managers both concur that no respray of the front bumper was necessary for the certification. granted, when i took delivery, the front bumper was in a lot better shape than it is in now (bugs and rock chips et al).

having spoken with my nearest dealership in san antonio, as well as with bmw of north america, i'm not getting good vibes that this clear coat issue will be covered under original warranty. i've positive though tt i can prove the clear coat issue was not due to rock chips, bugs or the like, since there are numerous spots of air bubbles forming, and the actual chipped clear coat area has a smooth, perfect painted surface underneath.

what should i do from here though?

[thekurgan]

Looks like it was repainted. If you find a paint shop, see if they can take some measurements of your paint to verify.

[towski1]

Looks repainted for sure. Here's another IB on autotrader right now.

http://images.autotrader.com/scaler/..._A.562x421.jpg

On all other colors, the strut towers seem body color without clearcoat...this pic looks the same for IB

[bdejong11129]

At first I couldnt believe that it could have been like that from the factory but then I did a search on Cars.com and several of the blue cars under the hood pictures paint looked like that....Hmmm, I would go to the dealer lots and pop the hoods on a few of them to verify.

[bdejong11129]

I looked a a ton of them and while base colors like White and black appear to be matched to the engine bay, the blue and reds appear to be different. Its like the paint it a base color and then paint the final color with the panels closed. Its wierd... Take a look at cars.com and browse the photos. Every base color engin bay is all one color. I have seen some fo the blue cars with what looks to be primer black on the fender edge like yours.

Take a close look at some of the Merlot Red colored cars and the engine bay paint(strut towers etc, almost looks like they are the Bright RED and not matching Merlot. I have to go and look at a few on the lot this week to see if this is true.

Here is the blue I saw, to me it does not look like the paint on the fender mounting surface matches.
http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail...5&aff=national

But this white one matches perfect.
http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail...5&aff=national

[Incompatible]

Originally Posted by r4gs

...
i'd given a call to the dealership i purchased cpo from in houston, and the sales and service managers both concur that no respray of the front bumper was necessary for the certification. granted, when i took delivery, the front bumper was in a lot better shape than it is in now (bugs and rock chips et al).

Sure looks like overspray to me. The dealership which sold you the car may be truthful in that no respray was necessary for cpo. Keep in mind though, that occasionally a dealer has an "oops" with a new car, repairs it, and then sells it with no one the wiser until much later. (Been there, done that - different marquee.) Another possibility is that the bumper was repainted by the owner prior to being traded in and the cpo inspection did not catch it. Regardless, it's going to be very difficult to get BMW NA to stand behind something which they don't see as their problem. Your best bet would be to take it up with the dealer you purchased the car from, but I wouldn't hold my breath. Good luck, but at the end of the day you'll probably end up dealing with it out of pocket.

[r4gs]

i've liaised with the dealer i'd purchased from, and they will most certainly get back with me regarding this issue. my main concern is whether this is a case of manufacturing defect or 3rd party respray done poorly. my front bumper does have a more noticeable orange peel effect than the rest of the car though, so maybe that is a clue as to whether it was resprayed before.

also, what does clear coat overspray mean and how do my pictures show evidence of that?

[KevinC]

I'm quite sure it's overspray - you've been resprayed for sure. The paint under the hood should be body color, but matte finish. That shot of blue fading into black on the inner fender is NOT right.

So here's my question if I'm in your shoes, and somebody here should be able to answer - what's the CPO policy on resprays and body work? At the very least, the selling dealer ought to be able to put this right as a goodwill gesture. You paid top dollar for the CPO treatment, and shouldn't have to worry about BS like this. Good luck with finding a satisfactory resolution.

[ZStig]

im guessing the dealer re-sprayed the car to make it a better sell

[r4gs]

Originally Posted by KevinC

I'm quite sure it's overspray - you've been resprayed for sure. The paint under the hood should be body color, but matte finish. That shot of blue fading into black on the inner fender is NOT right.

So here's my question if I'm in your shoes, and somebody here should be able to answer - what's the CPO policy on resprays and body work? At the very least, the selling dealer ought to be able to put this right as a goodwill gesture. You paid top dollar for the CPO treatment, and shouldn't have to worry about BS like this. Good luck with finding a satisfactory resolution.

the blue fading into black is in fact stock, as i've noticed the exact same finish on the brand new interlagos blue M in the album that dekaliber linked to. i've still got about two weeks of original manufacturer's warranty remaining, so i really shouldn't have to touch on cpo at all!

[Blind32]

I'm not sure what can be done. I purchased a CPO from Maryland in March. They told me they resprayed the front bumper to fix some rock chips. It looked great. Until June...

is what mine looks like now. Looks like they did a crappy prep job. I'm eager to see what the dealer says to you. I hope for the best in your case but I fear they will point the blame on you. Good luck!

[crfine88]

Originally Posted by r4gs

the blue fading into black is in fact stock, as i've noticed the exact same finish on the brand new interlagos blue M in the album that dekaliber linked to. i've still got about two weeks of original manufacturer's warranty remaining, so i really shouldn't have to touch on cpo at all!

Yes, IB engine bays are a flat dark blue.

The bumper does look like a re-spray. It is common for dealers to re-spary the front bumber before selling a car. Good luck getting it handled. Once they fix the problem, I recomend a clear bra to protect the work.

[chickdr]

NickC in this thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1506500 says he got his peeling bumper resprayed under warranty. Maybe you can get a free one too?

[r4gs]

i'm hoping the clear coat issue can be dealt with under warranty, but it's probably going to mean an entire respray of the front bumper, and the down time on that is about a week done right.

as for a clear bra, i'm entertaining that thought but understand that when my front bumper is redone, i shouldn't be applying a clear bra for at least a couple of months. something about letting the finish cure lest it adheres itself to the clear bra.

[r4gs]

update: houston dealer's willing to refinish the front bumper in-house on their charge, but will not budge on paying for an outsourced body shop other than their own 'trusted bumper guy'. also, they've asked me to make the 700 mile round trip back just to ascertain if the front bumper has been repainted or not for 'their knowledge'. i feel truly disgusted.

san antonio has basically put their hands up and said no warranty coverage, cos 4 separate professional opinions (3 in-person inspecting the bumper) have stated with certainty that the bumper has been repainted. i'm thinking houston peeps during the cpo process. telltales were the numerous tiny 'pits' from rock chips that have perfect paint and clearcoat over them, indicating the bumper was refinished without sanding. clearcoat used also did not have the flex additive required for use on plastics, and as such, cracked under the flex of the bumper in the texan heat here.

have decided to go out-of-pocket and have my front reflectors deleted and bumper holes plugged together with a full repaint and refinishing. will have rear reflectors painted as well. this episode has left a sour taste in my mouth concerning bmw dealerships. ralph schomp bmw of denver was so much better service wise!

[thekurgan]

What is your comprehensive coverage like? You may be better off using an insurance claim and take it where you want, maybe get ceramiclear coat?

[r4gs]

Originally Posted by thekurgan

What is your comprehensive coverage like? You may be better off using an insurance claim and take it where you want, maybe get ceramiclear coat?

overall cost will be below my deductible, so no go there. i will take a hit on the value of the car since it's going to be officially reflected that the front bumper has been repainted, sigh.

what are the various options on different clear coats, and for that matter, automotive paints, available? I'm interested in something harder that'll be more resistant to bugs and rock chips perhaps?