Noob here, and 2nd gear issues?

[FDJon]

Hello!

I've just joined this forum after buying an 07 Sapphireschwarz E86 M Coupe.. I've had her for 4 days now, with my first track day with her two days ago.
My previous car was a LSB '02 E46 M3, so i decided to go with the same motor in a lighter chassis..

So my question. (not the usual second gear clunk)

After 10 min of track driving, I'm losing 2nd gear completely- the shifter will not go in at all- leaving me to bog around in 3rd where I should be in 2nd..

Any ideas?

Thanks!!

-jon

[FDJon]

Stuff i forgot in my earlier post-

1. I am in Germany and my car is a German domestic vehicle.
2. This problem only occurs when the car is being tracked, AND when downshifting from 3rd to 2nd. Never from 1st to 2nd though..
3. I searched and didn't find anything similar to my problem.
4. Does anyone run a square setup to reduce understeer? (like the e46 track junkies)
5. Does anyone else here hate the stock Continental tires? (on track)

thanks again!

[inTgr8r]

congrats on the new car & welcome

2nd gear rejection;
This is a common track issue, usually occurring on downshifts at a hard right hand turn.
The fix is to upgrade the OE tanny mounts.

If you search "transmission mounts" there are several threads on the topic.

[FDJon]

Thank you!

[Finnegan]

Hi,

Congratulations on the car!

As InTg8r noted, denial of second is a very common issue. Here is the master thread on transmission mounts (engine mounts too).

I'd start with the neoprene rubber transmission mounts, and if you still have issues, consider the Rogue engine mounts. It's not just a transmission thing IMO--the engine itself has a lot of mass and also causes the drivetrain to move off center. Just my two cents.

Since you're a track guy, the following may be helpful (although this may be old news):

Camber kit (inexpensive) for the front.

Some more on street/track alignment

General track section (brakes, suspension, etc.). If you search, there are posts/threads on camber plates if you want a street/track adjustible solution (and there are some strong pro/cons on which plates work).

You may know this, but just in case, the Z4M uses the E36 M3 front end.

FWIW I'm running -2.8 zero toe front and -1.8 rear 1/16 total toe. It's a huge improvement over the max stock settings I had before (-1.5 front, -2.0 rear) on the track. I'm not running on the outside of my front tires anymore and the turn-in wonderful and the car's tendency to understeer with stock settings has been tamed. Lots of more advanced track rats around here run even more negative camber in the front (especially on R comps, I'm quite a bit away from that level).

Have fun, and welcome abroad!

[FDJon]

Oh cool, thanks.. Some good info here...

I'm really wondering HOW bad the NVH issues are with the UUC Poly's.. Since this car isn't a daily, and I would prefer a more raw feeling (and a more solid shift since I've never been a huge fan of BMW gearboxes), maybe I'd prefer these to the neoprenes? Would be great if I could get a ride to see what they're like first.. But I think it'll be impossible to find in Germany..

I know, it seems strange that I'm looking for solutions back home when I'm in Deutschland..

[FDJon]

Speaking of raw- my flatmate has an Exige S, and ever since rode along with him at a trackday, my car feels way too soft...

[Finnegan]

Originally Posted by FDJon

Oh cool, thanks.. Some good info here...

I'm really wondering HOW bad the NVH issues are with the UUC Poly's.. Since this car isn't a daily, and I would prefer a more raw feeling (and a more solid shift since I've never been a huge fan of BMW gearboxes), maybe I'd prefer these to the neoprenes? Would be great if I could get a ride to see what they're like first.. But I think it'll be impossible to find in Germany..

I know, it seems strange that I'm looking for solutions back home when I'm in Deutschland..

The neoprene mounts will help with a more solid feel; the other thing that would help is a good SSK. There was a group buy at one point (Autosolutions). I'm not sure if you can still get one or if it was a one-time thing. In any case, folks who got in the GB simply loved the results (when it was installed correctly). Here's a thread.

As for the 2nd issue (not shifter feel) and noise, I had the UUC red poly mounts and went to the Rogue neoprene. The car sounded like a John Deere tractor with the poly--I really hated it. It completelly drowned out the lovely S54 sounds. Now, if you have a super loud exhaust it probably doesn't matter, but if you're stock or have something quieter than "wake the dead" level, it's a pretty unpleasant sound IMO. The car isn't my daily either, but I like to enjoy it on and off the track. And, even with the UUC red poly I still have a second gear issue on the one really tight corner (abrupt right hand to left hand transistion which causes the drivetrain to slop around).

I think the total remedy are the Rogue neoprene engine + transmission mounts. Then engine is tall and has a high center of gravity, and obviously it's high mass. This leads to it moving about a bit as well, compounding the transmission mount issue. BMW has motorsport engine mounts to address this, but they're three times as expensive as the Rogue.

Originally Posted by FDJon

Speaking of raw- my flatmate has an Exige S, and ever since rode along with him at a trackday, my car feels way too soft...

Hmm, well, not surprising. The Exige S is a much more focused car. On the other hand I wouldn't want to drive it for several hours on end. My friend had a Elise, and while it was great fun and super stiff it really beat on the driver/passenger after some time in the car. I like the Z4M because it's got a balance of power and relatively stiff suspension (relative being the key word) that I can enjoy on a long back road trip without being totally beaten up by the end of the day.

It's the slippery slope re: track set up vs. street car. This is a really good discussion about the Z4M and the track, changes, eventual direction, and pro/con, coils/spring rates, track/street--I think it may be along the lines of where your thought process is going.

[FDJon]

Thanks again, Finnegan. Good stuff here. I think I will just go with the neoprenes then, with the motor mounts as well.. I'm just wondering if theres a German equivalent, or should I just have them shipped from home..

Sounded like a tractor? From the vibration/ noise transmission? Interesting..

I actually don't mind the Exige's ride too much actually.. For me it's "just right"- looks like i'll have to get some coilovers in the future..

[Endless619]

Originally Posted by inTgr8r

congrats on the new car & welcome

2nd gear rejection;
This is a common track issue, usually occurring on downshifts at a hard right hand turn.
The fix is to upgrade the OE tanny mounts.

If you search "transmission mounts" there are several threads on the topic.

Yup I am going with the new HPF setup...

[esqu1re]

Welcome. Let us know if the Tranny mounts clear up the problem for you. And --- awesome that you are tracking the car a few days after purchase!