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      07-18-2011, 04:39 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MIKe86 View Post
I would have gone ape shit nuts if I found out other people had the same issues of parts not fitting correctly and the damn company not resolving the issue BEFORE selling any more kits to people. 10g's isn't something to sneeze at (at least for me anyway).


Hope you get your pulley soon.
this is WAY more to do with the installers not talking their time to do proper checks imo........ IND install these all day long with perfect results
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      07-18-2011, 04:44 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by johanness View Post
So if I decide to get this install done @ RENNspec, I can look forward to ESS parts not fitting correctly (read: items too short etc)? It's not a simple case of waiting a week and picking the car up perfect? There are issues that the 3 of you have had where parts have to be modd'd to work right. Sounds like ESS needs to iron out the bugs still. Please correct me if I'm wrong here b/c I'm thinking of going this route.
you are wrong bro..... install just needs to be done with care..... the kit fits like a glove, its very tight with all these extra parts..... simpson motorsport inthe UK for me did an astounding job for me, IND in the US are imo they only people id use or ess themselves.
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      07-18-2011, 05:30 PM   #47
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iphone..... that noise is the belt, you can actually see the belt jumping off the pulley if you look closely..... Honestly you shouldnt be driving your car at all imo.............. thats putting ALOT of stress on the s/c bearings....

[...]

iphone your crank pulley will solve your issues, the s/c intake will need to be adjusted to ensure correct fitment.... lower engine mounts will not work for us, we'll lower the i/c piping to the point where we wont be able to fit under trays back on......................
iphone ANYTHING i can do to help, im here bro.....
OK, great to confirm that much at least. Checking out the video frame-by-frame, I don't see the belt "jumping off" persay, but it definitely whips with some resonation as it starts up. The belt should probably be replaced, as sure enough I found some tiny rubber shavings sprinkled on the S/C (loose black specs on bright silver makes them easy to see there).

At a minimum, I'm going to have to drive the car to San Diego to get it to the shop that Roman is sending me to sometime this week. It's going to be a real hassle getting a ride home and then back again to pick up the car, and be without it for at least 1, maybe 2+ days...but I am extremely thankful that Roman has, from the beginning, rushed towards fixing up the install.

The main thing I'm wondering at this point is if there is any way I can increase the belt tension temporarily (I'm not sure where the tensioner pulley is or how hard it is to access without having the undercover off), if only for the ~45 minute drive to San Diego.
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      07-18-2011, 06:57 PM   #48
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      07-18-2011, 07:06 PM   #49
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Great news: Roman has worked some magic and gotten me in with Chris at HG Motorworks in La Jolla, who seems just as eager to help. He will have the new pulley tomorrow, and will be able to take the car either tomorrow or the next day! That should solve the majority of my issues, and then there will be just the BPV to worry about--but I can certainly live with that until I get home to NorCal.

I'm second-guessing my choice to go with the BPV; if it needs to be replaced, maybe I should in fact go with the BOV as I was thinking about initially. I certainly haven't been impressed with the subtlety of the BPV woosh in normal driving conditions; it's pretty cool when you're at WOT and getting into the higher RPMs, but between silent and underwhelming around town.

cliffhopper: I'd love to show you the car assuming things are sorted by then, though Costa Mesa will be out of the way of my drive home from Murrieta. Maybe we can find a place to meet that's more along the way, or meet up before then. I will probably make at least one trip to Laguna Hills.

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      07-18-2011, 09:03 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by Beedub View Post
iphone..... that noise is the belt, you can actually see the belt jumping off the pulley if you look closely..... Honestly you shouldnt be driving your car at all imo.............. thats putting ALOT of stress on the s/c bearings....

Lets clear the vt2-500 issues up.... the intercooler piping does need alittle lengthening on some cars, other than that its complete plug and play, bear in mind its the same piping used on the m3 so it just needs alittle tweaking, some cars will need more than other but its imo no big deal at all, the s/c intake when fitted in the correct location WILL NOT touch the hoot AT ALL, i did warn you about this as youve refered to........ it needs to be nice and tucked into by the suspension turret...... it will never touch the hood in this location...

The crank pulley WAS in my instructions, as have them in front of me as i type..... IMO its all down to the installers, both my installs for vt1 and 2 have been bang on........ The type of kits will always require different alterations from car to car, im 100% happy with my vt2 kit.

Let me clarify my kit fits perfectly, no touching anywhere, hood or anything, great strutbrace clearance, great performance.... i couldnt be a happier ess customer....
come on guys, were adding a supercharger things will need to be tweaked, no car is the same. Mine has taken me a while to work out the little mods i needed to make but i now have a kit that fits like stock parts.... im about as happy as i could be. On top of everything the engine bay looks just awesome, i can look into it all day long............

iphone your crank pulley will solve your issues, the s/c intake will need to be adjusted to ensure correct fitment.... lower engine mounts will not work for us, we'll lower the i/c piping to the point where we wont be able to fit under trays back on......................
iphone ANYTHING i can do to help, im here bro.....
I don't know if ess gave you a free kit or what for you to be repping them so hard - but you say your install was PERFECT from your shop, but in the next breath say how it took you 6 months to get all the tweaks worked out and get things to how you thought they should be.

IMO, and no I'm not wrong because it's just that - an opinion, at $10k+ for a kit plus labor costs if you want it warrantied and whatever other fees on top to fix the tweaks, it shouldn't take 6 MONTHS to get it fitting or running like OEM.

Again, it's JMHO and I personally will wait to see what other's experiences are both short term and long term.

I hope it's more positive things about the kit. So far it seems the best and worst things about the kit are it's service. On one hand people are getting shipped kits with missing parts consistently and on the other Roman gets great praise for doing the right thing and fixing errors ASAP. So while its disconcerting that people are getting incomplete kits and waiting weeks for a full kit to arrive, it's nice to see that at least when something goes wrong the issue is taken care of and not pushed to the side.

Which all leads back to.. The jury is still out.
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      07-18-2011, 10:06 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by MIKe86 View Post
[...] I hope it's more positive things about the kit. So far it seems the best and worst things about the kit are it's service. On one hand people are getting shipped kits with missing parts consistently and on the other Roman gets great praise for doing the right thing and fixing errors ASAP. So while its disconcerting that people are getting incomplete kits and waiting weeks for a full kit to arrive, it's nice to see that at least when something goes wrong the issue is taken care of and not pushed to the side. [...]
To give my honest opinion on the situation, as in-progress as it is:
1) The praise for ESS' kit quality is abundant and diverse. There are some very well-repped independent folk who call their actual tuning prowess second-to-none. Component quality is top notch and system reliability / testing is renowned.
2) Posts from the past speak very highly of ESS customer service. More recent posts have indicated there has been a significant slowing of response time to emails, even from customers who have already placed orders. E.g., at times I even had trouble getting a tracking number. I suspect this is related to the rapid increase in popularity they've seen, even over the past two months alone, and that they are working to staff up and defend their customer service reputation.
3) When there IS an actual problem, the guys are certainly right there to help. Their warranty is great and they spare no expense fixing any mistake, overnighting parts or rushing them from Europe as standard procedure. In addition to working me in so quickly, Roman takes it for granted that they will replace the intake pipe that has gained a scratch from hitting the hood (though that will probably happen back at home, since that part wasn't overnighted with the pulley).

I suspect that some of the recent mistakes that have been discussed, particularly the kits missing parts, are also directly related to understaffing and their abrupt popularity increase. The IC pipe issue is not that surprising given the kit was just adapted for our cars--they spent the time getting the tune right and probably reused a pipe from the E46 kit without realizing that non-ESS mechanics might have a lot of difficulty getting a proper fit. Based on the way these guys run their business, I'm sure a resolution is forthcoming.

It really sucks to see my car in such an unhappy state, but human errors happen and I couldn't imagine a much better response to the problem.
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      07-19-2011, 02:49 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MIKe86 View Post
I don't know if ess gave you a free kit or what for you to be repping them so hard - but you say your install was PERFECT from your shop, but in the next breath say how it took you 6 months to get all the tweaks worked out and get things to how you thought they should be.

IMO, and no I'm not wrong because it's just that - an opinion, at $10k+ for a kit plus labor costs if you want it warrantied and whatever other fees on top to fix the tweaks, it shouldn't take 6 MONTHS to get it fitting or running like OEM.

Again, it's JMHO and I personally will wait to see what other's experiences are both short term and long term.

I hope it's more positive things about the kit. So far it seems the best and worst things about the kit are it's service. On one hand people are getting shipped kits with missing parts consistently and on the other Roman gets great praise for doing the right thing and fixing errors ASAP. So while its disconcerting that people are getting incomplete kits and waiting weeks for a full kit to arrive, it's nice to see that at least when something goes wrong the issue is taken care of and not pushed to the side.

Which all leads back to.. The jury is still out.
i can only give you my experience, going from vt1 to vt2, ive never had issues like iphone......i work very hard for my money so im insulted you should ask if i got a "free kit" what a dickhead comment to make?? lol you may get by in life on freebies but i pay my way sir :-)

now back to the kit....... again my kit has been great, any issues ive had has been from my installers imo..... because of the way i am, i basically stripped the car down, noting any area where it can be improved, i then moved, modded, added parts, measured clearances..... it did take me months to get it how i wanted but then again im a perfectionist...... The key here is install, the install was done poorly i have no doubt in my mind, look back at ALL my recommendations and the issues iphone is seeing ive pretty much mentioned them all ;-) Leaving the crank pulley out was a stupid error though........

but imo ess has been great.... cant fault them or the kit..... im a very happy customer... ill be buying a kit for the v8 m3 soon :-)
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      07-19-2011, 02:53 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iPhoneEngineer View Post
To give my honest opinion on the situation, as in-progress as it is:
1) The praise for ESS' kit quality is abundant and diverse. There are some very well-repped independent folk who call their actual tuning prowess second-to-none. Component quality is top notch and system reliability / testing is renowned.
2) Posts from the past speak very highly of ESS customer service. More recent posts have indicated there has been a significant slowing of response time to emails, even from customers who have already placed orders. E.g., at times I even had trouble getting a tracking number. I suspect this is related to the rapid increase in popularity they've seen, even over the past two months alone, and that they are working to staff up and defend their customer service reputation.
3) When there IS an actual problem, the guys are certainly right there to help. Their warranty is great and they spare no expense fixing any mistake, overnighting parts or rushing them from Europe as standard procedure. In addition to working me in so quickly, Roman takes it for granted that they will replace the intake pipe that has gained a scratch from hitting the hood (though that will probably happen back at home, since that part wasn't overnighted with the pulley).

I suspect that some of the recent mistakes that have been discussed, particularly the kits missing parts, are also directly related to understaffing and their abrupt popularity increase. The IC pipe issue is not that surprising given the kit was just adapted for our cars--they spent the time getting the tune right and probably reused a pipe from the E46 kit without realizing that non-ESS mechanics might have a lot of difficulty getting a proper fit. Based on the way these guys run their business, I'm sure a resolution is forthcoming.

It really sucks to see my car in such an unhappy state, but human errors happen and I couldn't imagine a much better response to the problem.
the kit was adapted from the m3..... and ess havent put the kit on their site for this reason :-) when you see how well everything is integrated into the engion bay im quite frankly blown away to only have a boost pipe thats to short...... we lengthened that pipe (ess completely know about this) under ess instruction....... no probs!! Ess will only allow certain shops to do the vt2 due to complexity.... no you know why ;-)

the key is getting you back on the road, imo your shop should have given you a loan car and no let you drive this thing in this state...... the metal on metal sound your hearing is probably the belt bucking and causning stress on the pulley bearing.......

again check the s/c oil level please and come back :-) it should be just below the hatched area ;-)
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      07-19-2011, 03:01 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by Beedub View Post
i work ver hard for my money so im insulted you should ask if i got a "free kit" what a dickhead comment to make?? lol you may get by in life on freebies but i pay my way sir :-)

I made that comment not because I thought you were broke and got it for free, but because of how much you've been sticking up for, troubleshooting, and defending ESS - almost as if you had gotten the kit free in exchange for positive press type of deal (or maybe even an undercover employee )

Anyway, was trying to make a point, not insult you. Hopefully one day I'll be successfull as you are and have to choose which one of my M's I'll take out in the morning and during the day figure out which one I want to s/c first.
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      07-19-2011, 09:05 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by MIKe86 View Post
I made that comment not because I thought you were broke and got it for free, but because of how much you've been sticking up for, troubleshooting, and defending ESS - almost as if you had gotten the kit free in exchange for positive press type of deal (or maybe even an undercover employee )

Anyway, was trying to make a point, not insult you. Hopefully one day I'll be successfull as you are and have to choose which one of my M's I'll take out in the morning and during the day figure out which one I want to s/c first.
i wish i worked for ess #sign# anyhow i work for myself in private healthcare :-) how boring..... Re the sticking up for ess, i am to be honest because from Personal experience and from what im seeing here their name is easily tarnished for problems caused by the installers, any bad experience with ess ive posted publically, in one instance i had a serious run in with AJ over some of my comments so trust me im unbiased.

i am the type of person who will simply not fit anything to a car without fitment being perfect, so i basically removed 85% of the components and changed parts, added parts, moved items and ive pretty muich learned all tkey key area's that need extra attention, like the position of the s/c intake, to high it'll bump the hood, to low it'll rub the suspension turret, just right it will simply touch no-where, its this painstaking process ive spent months perfecting, going out driving the car hard, measuring and so on and so on, now 90% of the things ive done is just time and want for perfection, now i have that but the kit as it came was great, 99% of people wouldnt do what i did, so i basiclaly come on here and share my knowledge with other owners, pretty much all the issues outlined by iphone ive mentioned in previous posts and advised on positioning ect ect or fitment..... im just as petrolhead who genuinely loves his hobby....

please excuse me comment, it was early and i now see where you were heading, Ess im willing to become an employee anytime please!! lol
my tuner damaged my s/c unit, ess had me a new one on @ my front door within 3 days...... now thats service :-)
i am simply a very happy vt2 customer and i will share every single piece of knowledge ive learned to make sure people's experience is as mine, i will however say its very easy to damage a companies name, so i do feel when i see things that are install problems i will highlight it...

mike if you ever go s/c you will be very happy :-)

iphone... to tighten you need to turn the allen key head on the tensioner closest to the s/c unit :-) nice and easy :-)
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      07-19-2011, 09:18 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iPhoneEngineer View Post
cliffhopper: I'd love to show you the car assuming things are sorted by then, though Costa Mesa will be out of the way of my drive home from Murrieta. Maybe we can find a place to meet that's more along the way, or meet up before then. I will probably make at least one trip to Laguna Hills.
I PMed you, it's a more appropriate venue for our coversation.

Glad you're getting some things taken care of in La Jolla, beats waiting for the end of your trip. Hopefully the pulley will take care of the metal on metal sound.
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      07-19-2011, 11:52 AM   #57
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I think Beedub speaks so highly of this kit because of how fun as fuck it makes the car
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      07-19-2011, 11:54 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iPhoneEngineer View Post
cliffhopper: I'd love to show you the car assuming things are sorted by then, though Costa Mesa will be out of the way of my drive home from Murrieta. Maybe we can find a place to meet that's more along the way, or meet up before then. I will probably make at least one trip to Laguna Hills.
I PMed you, it's a more appropriate venue for our coversation.

Glad you're getting some things taken care of in La Jolla, beats waiting for the end of your trip. Hopefully the pulley will take care of the metal on metal sound.
Sadly..... I think damage may be done to the s/c unit..... metal on metal shouldnt be happening, loose pulley or not :-(
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      07-19-2011, 11:55 AM   #59
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I think Beedub speaks so highly of this kit because of how fun as fuck it makes the car
Yessss tom gets it!!!!
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      07-19-2011, 12:04 PM   #60
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Yikes.

I don't like how this whole thing is sounding. No pun intended.

iPhoneEngineer, I hope this all gets sorted quickly. It has to be both frustrating and disappointing to have issues at this point. I'm sure ESS will take care of you and work to make things right.
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      07-19-2011, 01:03 PM   #61
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yeah i have to say this must be pretty scary for you right now iphone........ i cant wait for this to be sorted to get a proper review from you :-(

i keep listening to that noise and the more and more im hearing........ th more concerned im getting..... im keeping my fingers crossed the "bucking" of the belt was putting momentary stress causing this noise...... right now i feel the crank pulley which SHOULD be with the kit will solve most if not all your issues :-)
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      07-19-2011, 01:59 PM   #62
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Sadly..... I think damage may be done to the s/c unit..... metal on metal shouldnt be happening, loose pulley or not :-(
To be clear, I have no objective indication that there is really metal scraping. I'm pretty convinced at this point that the screech is in fact just the belt slipping on cold startup, not the internals of the S/C. Beedub, the video I posted of the screech is a pretty good capture of what it sounds like, and you don't figure that's from the S/C itself do you?

The actual S/C whirs like a finely-tuned jet engine at engine speeds over ~1500RPM. Below that (mainly below 1200RPM) it can be a little rattly as everyone describes to be normal. My suspicion is that the individual power pulses are more distinct and separated at those engine speeds and it causes the gears in the S/C to knock together a bit; a compromise since they are truly designed to run smoothly at extremely high RPM.

Obviously if there is still a screech with the new pulley and proper tensioning, the S/C will be to blame and have to be replaced, but I think that is extremely unlikely to be the cause or to be necessary. Some have implied that these are really fragile pieces of equipment, but it's a freaking vortech supercharger--a mechanical beast that isn't going to be junked by a little bit of belt wobble on less than 5 cold startups I've done. If it really were that delicate, I can't imagine it withstanding a single day at the track, proper belt tension or not.

The car is already in the hands of HG Motorsport who plan to not only replace the pulley and belt, but also at least diagnose the BPV whistle.

Last night I drove across town at night with the windows down...little traffic, pretty quiet out. It's the most rewarding experience I had with the kit yet and gave me some encouragement that the issues will be sorted. Perhaps my favorite thing about the noises the kit adds to the car is when decelerating to a stop--as the engine sweeps down in RPM, especially from 2k to idle, it arguably sounds like a gas turbine is under the hood! :-D It sounds very sophisticated and exotic; I'm sure it will turn heads over time as drivers or pedestrians notice a sound they've never heard of coming from the car that definitely exudes performance, unlike the damn BPV whistle .

Last edited by iPhoneEngineer; 07-19-2011 at 02:11 PM..
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      07-19-2011, 02:06 PM   #63
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To be clear, I have no objective indication that there is really metal scraping. I'm pretty convinced at this point that the screech is in fact just the belt slipping on cold startup, not the internals of the S/C. Beedub, the video I posted of the screech is a pretty good capture of what it sounds like, and you don't figure that's from the S/C itself do you?

The actual S/C whirs like a finely-tuned jet engine at engine speeds over ~1500RPM. Below that (mainly below 1200RPM) it can be a little rattly as everyone describes to be normal. My suspicion is that the individual power pulses are more distinct and separated at those engine speeds and it causes the gears in the S/C to knock together a bit; a compromise since they are truly designed to run smoothly at extremely high RPM.

Obviously if there is still a screech with the new pulley and proper tensioning, the S/C will be to blame and have to be replaced, but I think that is extremely unlikely to be the cause or to be necessary. Some have implied that these are really fragile pieces of equipment, but it's a freaking vortech supercharger--a mechanical beast that isn't going to be junked by a little bit of belt wobble on less than 5 cold startups I've done.

The car is already in the hands of HG Motorsport who plan to not only replace the pulley and belt, but also at least diagnose the BPV whistle.
actually i agree with you..... the s/c cant be damaged as the faster you spun it the more noise it would make, so no i dont think it is damaged thinking logically about it, it must just be the "loose" belt creating wierd stress noise on the bearing, these blowers are however noisey on idle, but not enough to be a huge worry...... they kinda make a constant rattle noise but its faint enough to not really hear it with the hood down, some are noiseyier than others, if you youtube noisey vortech v3, you'll get loads of clips of the noises were talking about :-)

when does your new crank pulley come in???

thank god the car is back at the tuners, they and ess will hook you up :-) cant wait for you to get this shitty ordeal sorted like now!!!!
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      07-19-2011, 02:17 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by Beedub View Post
[...] they kinda make a constant rattle noise but its faint enough to not really hear it with the hood down, some are noiseyier than others, if you youtube noisey vortech v3, you'll get loads of clips of the noises were talking about :-)

when does your new crank pulley come in???

thank god the car is back at the tuners, they and ess will hook you up :-) cant wait for you to get this shitty ordeal sorted like now!!!!
Beedub, does your rattle noise get a little bit louder when you're engaging the clutch in first? Mine is noticeable at idle and the car sounds a bit more like a diesel when engaging due to it increasing a bit, but of course it quickly disappears at anything close to a normal driving RPM. I am certainly not lugging the engine, but I think the additional load on it exacerbates the phenomenon I described above which I suspect is responsible for the idle rattle. If that is correct then it is normal operation.

Crank pulley was overnighted yesterday or the day before and was supposed to arrive by 10AM at the tuner's place today. So, I am supposed to have the car back TODAY! The shop did quote me $300, so I'm not sure how that will work out, but I don't mind paying for it now under the assumption that ESS intends to reimburse me (that was my implicit understanding).
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      07-19-2011, 02:59 PM   #65
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honestly??? No it doesnt... tbh its not very easy to hear from the drivers seat.....
Before we comment we must see what its like with the pulley change, i think it will change the noises you hearing....

mine sounds nothing like a diesel...... its a very suble bearingy type noise...... a mecanical noise, rattle type noise, but make no bones about it, ive heard perfectly good blowers sound like stones in a tin can at idle, so im not suprised, as long as you unit isnt blowing its fluid out and sounds good @ high RPM your good to go.

wahooooo car back today!!!! more clips with this thing fixed!!

p.s your mom is awesome!!! lol that is sooo a mom thing to do!!! "arhhh that sounds aweful" lol yes mom thanks for sugar coating that for me to make me feel better!! lol, thats exactly what my mom would do!!! lol bless her!!
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      07-19-2011, 03:19 PM   #66
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Yeah, "diesel" is an exaggeration I guess. But it's a pretty noticeable sound since the motor itself isn't loud at that speed. I'm not concerned about that at this stage, especially since the S/C will probably continue to break in and the new pulley will have it spinning faster at all engine speeds, meaning it will never be going as slow as it currently does around idle. I bet it will be more subtle after the change.

I just got word--the car is ready! I have to call back to ask if anything was determined about the BPV, and I won't be able to get a ride to it until later this afternoon, but good news that the pulley arrived etc.
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