Suspension or wheels/tires?

[DEG]

I am new to this forum. I just picked up a 06 3.0i and am planning on enhancing the car. It does not have the sport suspension. I have been reading posts on this forum for about a week and have learned a lot!! Collectively, this forum is full of terrific information. The plan on this car is:
1. Suspension enhancements: Eibachs, Koni shocks, Rogue Engineering RSM plates.
2. Upgraded wheels and tires... still not sure if I will go with 18" or 19"
3. Later: engine/exhaust enhancements.

Question: Which should I do first? Suspension or wheels/tires? Wouldn't how the car sits after the Eibachs and Koni's dictate the wheel/tire size? I am kind of leaning toward the suspension first and then the wheels/tires.

Your suggestions would be most helpful!

[ZStig]

budget?

[DEG]

For suspension upgrades as noted above: I have figured parts alone were around $1200 without labor... wheels/tires... depends upon whether I go with 18" or 19", nonetheless I am budgeting around $2500. So, for suspension/wheels/tires plus labor around 4k.

[Juice84]

Why do you want to upgrade the car? Track days, looks, etc?

For either I would probably suggest wheels and tires first. If you are wanting to do track days and you already have some good rubber on the wheels, then I would do suspension.

If you are just looking for a drop what you listed would be fine, if you are looking for a bit more performance out of your suspension, you might want to look toward GC or KW, you will get more adjustability with those.

[DEG]

Thanks for getting back with me. I am looking for a drop and upgrade the looks. Not interested in track days. Thanks for the information on the other shocks (GC/KW)... I will look into those as well because being able to get a little more adjustment and performance might be something I might want to do. Great suggestion.

I have read that if you add 19" tires/wheels without a suspension drop, there is still a considerable gap between the wheel well and the tire, giving the car an "SUV" look. Also, by going with the wheels/tires first... do you run the risk of putting too big of tire on the car and not being able to drop? I don't want to run the risk of rubbing as I have read on some other threads.

Sorry for these elementary questions, I am a "newbie" at this and just starting to learn.

Many Thanks!

[Juice84]

The gap doesnt change when you add bigger wheels, assuming you keep the diameter the same (you should get as close as possible). It just becomes more apparent is all with the thinner tire.

I guess you could possible drop it too low and have issues but that is where adjust-ability come into play. If you stick to sizes and offsets that others on here are running you shouldnt have any issues.

[DEG]

Thanks for the explanation, but that is what is still confusing to me when you speak of "keeping the diameter the same"... if you are going from 17" to 19", how is one keeping the diameter the same? Isn't that increasing the diameter? I am not an engineer so I apologize for my ignorance

[Blind32]

He means, more wheel less tire, diameter stays the same. I was perplexed at first too.

[Juice84]

decrease in the tires side wall height to offset the larger wheels

[JD3]

I've done that math on this, to go 19's and keep the "same" diameter, you'd want to go from 225/40 to a 225/35 and from a 255/35 to a 255/30 or a 265/30. Although a lot of guys go with a 235/35 on the front.
Don't forget when you're doing your math to multiply the sidewall height by 2 to account for the top and bottom of the tire. In a perfect world, if you're going up an inch in wheel size, you want the sidewall height to be apporx 12.7 mm shorter which would give 25.4 mm less tire, or 1 inch less. Unfortunately with the options available you can't get it exactly the same a lot of times.
If you're buying your tires from a reputable source, they'll be able to tell you what best to do.

[M II]

Originally Posted by DEG

For suspension upgrades as noted above: I have figured parts alone were around $1200 without labor... wheels/tires... depends upon whether I go with 18" or 19", nonetheless I am budgeting around $2500. So, for suspension/wheels/tires plus labor around 4k.

You need the help of **********s!

We have a lot of different products you can choose from. You can call me at (714) 582-3330 x 8004 for the specifics. Looking forward to helping you out with your car!

[DEG]

Thanks everyone for the posts!! Everyone's help is most appreciated.

[gatorfast]

Originally Posted by DEG

Thanks for the explanation, but that is what is still confusing to me when you speak of "keeping the diameter the same"... if you are going from 17" to 19", how is one keeping the diameter the same? Isn't that increasing the diameter? I am not an engineer so I apologize for my ignorance

By keeping the same diameter he means wheel + tire in total. For a simple example lets say you have an 18 inch wheel and the tire for it is 4 inches thick for a total diameter of 22 inches. If you replaced those with 19 in wheels, you would want to get a thinner tire, one that is 3 inches thick, to still give you a total diameter of 22 inches.

[crfine88]

I would do KW suspenison + wheel spacers

[M II]

Originally Posted by crfine88

I would do KW suspenison + wheel spacers

[Jbs]

Originally Posted by crfine88

I would do KW suspenison + wheel spacers

Originally Posted by **********s II

[jra]

eibachs and konis would look nice with 17's. get the suspension sorted out and then decide on the wheels.

[DEG]

Thanks everyone... the fog is starting to clear (a little bit) (:

This is back to jra: you said that "eibachs and konis would look nice with 17's", but I notice you are running 19" SSR Comp H with the same set up. I am assuming that the eibachs and the konis would support 18's or 19's.

BTW: Thanks for all of the clear explanations on the diameter question.

[jra]

DEG,

the koni/eibach combo will handle the 17's as well as 18" or 19" wheels when you upgrade. there really is no reason to get coilovers unless you track the car or really want to dial in your suspension. the koni/eibach combo has become the standard for non m spring/shock upgrade. the one thing I will suggest is to really research wheels. if you go with heavy 19" or 18" wheels you will feel the added weight. get the lighest wheels you can afford. btw 19" wheels on non sport suspension doesn't look that bad and the only people who will notice are suspension buffs.

[DEG]

Thanks jra for getting back with me. Your information is reassuring as far as the koni/eibach combo. Don't plan on tracking the car, just want to drop it to give it a "better" look. Thanks for the advice on the wheels as far as the weight. You and everyone on this thread have been extremely helpful.

[M II]

Originally Posted by DEG

Thanks for the explanation, but that is what is still confusing to me when you speak of "keeping the diameter the same"... if you are going from 17" to 19", how is one keeping the diameter the same? Isn't that increasing the diameter? I am not an engineer so I apologize for my ignorance

The profile of your tire is thinner on a 19" wheel than a tire on a 17" wheel. You want to keep the rolling diameter the same as your stock setup so that your speedo is accurate and your gearing doesn't change.

I have a few reasons why I think coilover is a better choice:

1. Quality coilovers like the KWs have a lifetime warranty which should give you reassurance that they're built to last.

2. Coilovers and shock / spring setup costs the same to install since they involve taking out the same components.

3. It's much easier selling a set of coilovers on the used market than a shock / spring combo and the resale is much higher as well.

4. You can change the ride height on coilovers while the shock / spring combo is static at wherever the springs settle to. I know you're not taking your car to the track, but your car is an EXCELLENT car for autocross! Coilovers allow you to corner weight and balance the car while shock / spring setups can't.


If you add it up, coilovers are a little more expensive as an initial investment but in the long run - they pretty much even out in expense.

As for the wheels, lighter is always better! Put it this way, 1 lbs of unsprung weight is equal to about 10 lbs of static weight. There are so many affordable lightweight wheel options out there - so you should be covered there.


Feel free to shoot over a PM or call me if you have any questions!