Stud conversion z4mc

[Vanne]

Hi guys, just wondering if anyone can recommend me a stud conversion set for my car? I am running 10 mill spacer in the front and 3 mill spacer in the rear.
How are the turner Motorsport kits?
Or better yet if you know someone who's selling a set

Cheers

Experiences positive or negative with said kits?

[Beedub]

been running the turner kits for nearly 2 years, never let me or my car down despite numerous track days, looks awesome, practical, a very good for imo for extra safety and ease of changing wheels!

[Beedub]

On track/lots of on and off wheels/added heat these do loosen off and need periodic re-Tqing... no biggy imo.

[Finnegan]

I have one set I bought from Apex and another from Turner. The Allen key on the Turner set was a bit easier to install, but using the double nut approach isn't a big deal either. You can use the 75mm up to a 10mm spacer in front. If you're using 10mm spacers with no built in hub extenders then the Turner extenders work very well to keep wheels safely in place. That might just make Turner the place to buy both.

And yes, what Beedub said about tightening, although with locktite mine haven't loosened yet.

[Small Yellow]

Pm me. I actually have a friend selling his set because he sold his car.

[Kgolf31]

I ran Vorshlag Studs for 2 years now, when I went to transfer them to my 128i, they were not loose...pretty tight still. Loctite held them in fine

[jdoublehcubed]

Originally Posted by Finnegan

I have one set I bought from Apex and another from Turner. The Allen key on the Turner set was a bit easier to install, but using the double nut approach isn't a big deal either. You can use the 75mm up to a 10mm spacer in front. If you're using 10mm spacers with no built in hub extenders then the Turner extenders work very well to keep wheels safely in place. That might just make Turner the place to buy both.

And yes, what Beedub said about tightening, although with locktite mine haven't loosened yet.

I would say if you're running 10mm spacers with no hub extenders, your just asking for a problem.

[nekky]

Originally Posted by Kgolf31

I ran Vorshlag Studs for 2 years now, when I went to transfer them to my 128i, they were not loose...pretty tight still. Loctite held them in fine

I have the Vorshlag as well.. No problems and mine are loctited too! Great upgrade, and the nuts that come with are good quality. Buy with confidence.

[Beedub]

turner 75mm items here.... think ill renew them next year for piece of mind, they've dealt with alot of track time and Tq-ing in their time.

[z4msteve]

I'm nearly positive the Vorshlag studs are just the APEX studs and hardware being resold at a higher price.

[The HACK]

I've had my RacingBrake 75mm studs on the car for over 6 years now and through hundreds of wheel changes. The hex head design made it extra easy to install. The 75mm studs are very subtle on the ET30 rear wheels, but stick out a little on the front. Now I'm running 275mm all around with 4 rear wheels, the face of the stud sits flush with the wheel's face.

The nose isn't bulleted, but again, in 6+ years and hundred of wheel changes I have not yet cross-threaded the bolt when installing with an impact gun (knock on wood).

[sipman]

Hack, you probably discussed this elsewhere. You're running square with 4 rears? Are you having issues with turning radius/wheel strike? What have you discovered on the track? No more understeer?
Also, are you running the fronts full around as a street set?

[seank]

Originally Posted by sipman

Hack, you probably discussed this elsewhere. You're running square with 4 rears? Are you having issues with turning radius/wheel strike? What have you discovered on the track? No more understeer?
Also, are you running the fronts full around as a street set?

I'm confused too. It is counter to what Hack has brain washed the z4 community about. He is persuasive though and makes good points. Despite his scrub radius rants, fast wins no matter what.


Regarding studs, I think they are all the same but the Allen helps with install.

[Vanne]

Originally Posted by Small Yellow

Pm me. I actually have a friend selling his set because he sold his car.

Pm sent yesterday

[angelr]

my square 265's/275's are considerably faster than the oem staggered sizes.

grip=good

Originally Posted by seank

I'm confused too. It is counter to what Hack has brain washed the z4 community about. He is persuasive though and makes good points. Despite his scrub radius rants, fast wins no matter what.


Regarding studs, I think they are all the same but the Allen helps with install.

[The HACK]

Originally Posted by sipman

Hack, you probably discussed this elsewhere. You're running square with 4 rears? Are you having issues with turning radius/wheel strike? What have you discovered on the track? No more understeer?
Also, are you running the fronts full around as a street set?

Yes the tires rub the fender liners on full lock. You can hear a pretty nasty rubbing sound pulling into and out of tight parking spaces. I wouldn't do it for strictly street use. Turning radius is drastically decreased for any usable street application. Make no mistake, the front end isn't designed to hold 275mm worth of tires.

What is this "understeer" you speak of? My chassis has been very neutral ever since I dialed in about 2.5º of negative camber up front, even with 245f/275r stagger. Even on stock camber it is far more likely to oversteer than understeer when driven angrily. The front end does not lack for grip, the little bit of turn-in understeer can easily be corrected by adjusting your braking point and release point, i.e. trail brake at the right time for the right turns. You know, the key to achieving a FAST lap in just about any car? There are two major reasons I switched to 4 rears on 275s all around:

1: I needed to run the rear wheels up front because I don't want to use spacers for the track. The rear offset up front clears the RacingBrake fixed calipers with plenty of room to spare.

2: The Maxxis RC-1 R-Comp scrubs I picked up from my friend only comes in 275mm width.

To be completely honest? I probably would have been happy to continue to run a 245f/275r stagger. The additional "grip" afforded me up front now probably will require a slight adjustment in my driving to take full advantage, meaning now, in all likelihood, I can probably brake a little less and carry more speed through the first 1/2 of turn-in for more laps, resulting in faster lap times and more consistent lap times.

Understeer is mostly induced by driver and NOT inherent in any of these car's set up. Yes the staggered set up may "promote" understeer, but that understeer is always a direct result of a driver's input. Has nothing to do with the car, at least, not on THIS car.

Now that the dissertation is over...No I do not run the 275mm set-up on the street nor do I intend to. After my track weekend I swap back to my street set of Falken RT-615K on my Alpina Dynamic Replicas, 18"x8.5" et38 with 245/40/R18 tires front on a 5mm spacer, 18"x9.5" et26 with 275/35/R18 rears.

[sipman]

I have some under steer issues at NJMP's octopus. There's a long tight left hand constant radius turn that probably 180 degree+. Go in too fast and I under steer and can't get any trailing throttle oversteer. It's a little disappointing to follow 911s into this turn and watch them reduce the turns radius so easily. If I go in without under steer, it's so slow I'm left with throttle on oversteer. But that's really the only location I've got complaints on.

From your prior posts on the wheel section, I'm thinking the rears up front will only work with coil overs? The stock springs seem too wide. Any idea if that's true?

[The HACK]

Originally Posted by sipman

I have some under steer issues at NJMP's octopus. There's a long tight left hand constant radius turn that probably 180 degree+. Go in too fast and I under steer and can't get any trailing throttle oversteer. It's a little disappointing to follow 911s into this turn and watch them reduce the turns radius so easily. If I go in without under steer, it's so slow I'm left with throttle on oversteer. But that's really the only location I've got complaints on.

From your prior posts on the wheel section, I'm thinking the rears up front will only work with coil overs? The stock springs seem too wide. Any idea if that's true?

Turn 9 at Auto Club Speedway is a 180º decreasing radius, off camber hairpin and while I find that I'd lose ground on some Porsches, it's not because the car "understeers" but because those damn Porsches brake so f**king well that you can literally brake at the last second, well into the first half of the actual turn-in. Plus their weight in the rear just promotes grip and traction out of the off-camber hairpin. It's actually the first 1/3rd of the turn where I had to brake earlier that I lose ground, and on the exit where they just lay down power so much better. I can actually hold and maintain higher speed in the middle section of this particular turn to keep things interesting.

I would actually suggest, that the place to look for fixes for you may not be in stuffing wider tires up front, but to fix it with better brake hardware. It sounds counter-intuitive, but if you can delay and compress your braking zone, you may find that this chassis will handle said tight hairpin 180 just as well as the Porsches. I give no guarantees on the exit, that inherent grip and power advantage to the rear wheels on the exit of a slow turn is just hard to over-come. If your brake hardware is up to par, I think you can keep up with those damn FWD cars going backwards.

As far as the hardware to fit wider tires up front is concerned, I would gander that the limitation isn't the coil overs, but the factory camber. Despite the factory springs being wider, they're actually sitting on a large perch that sits on top of the wheel. The mounting point of the perch would actually make a stock suspension more friendly to running these wider set-ups, since the closest point to the wheel/tire right now on my coil-over is the HEIGHT ADJUSTER COLLAR. If I can move the collar up and run shorter and stiffer springs up front, then I would gain anywhere between another 5-8mm of clearance on the inside.

Not that I need it.

I would bet, if you can get to -3º camber on the stock suspension parts (shimmed, camber plates, whatever you have to do), the rear 275s would fit and clear the fenders so you don't have to worry about rubbing on track. You will, however, rub the fender liners on the street when the steering wheel is turned far enough.

[angelr]

Let's just say that I disagree with you. A quick look at the z4's that competed in the etgp last year, some very fast tracked z4's around the country, bmw's own z4gte and my own experience all contradict you. If they run any stagger at all it is very small like 265/275 or 300/310 in the case of the gte. I'm thinking that it's much more down to your preference as it most certainly is not fact as you try and represent it. All understeer is driver induced...

camber, toe, bars, spring rate, tire pressures...just a few things that can affect the apparently static relationship between understeer and oversteer on a given chassis

Originally Posted by The HACK

Yes the tires rub the fender liners on full lock. You can hear a pretty nasty rubbing sound pulling into and out of tight parking spaces. I wouldn't do it for strictly street use. Turning radius is drastically decreased for any usable street application. Make no mistake, the front end isn't designed to hold 275mm worth of tires.

What is this "understeer" you speak of? My chassis has been very neutral ever since I dialed in about 2.5º of negative camber up front, even with 245f/275r stagger. Even on stock camber it is far more likely to oversteer than understeer when driven angrily. The front end does not lack for grip, the little bit of turn-in understeer can easily be corrected by adjusting your braking point and release point, i.e. trail brake at the right time for the right turns. You know, the key to achieving a FAST lap in just about any car? There are two major reasons I switched to 4 rears on 275s all around:

1: I needed to run the rear wheels up front because I don't want to use spacers for the track. The rear offset up front clears the RacingBrake fixed calipers with plenty of room to spare.

2: The Maxxis RC-1 R-Comp scrubs I picked up from my friend only comes in 275mm width.

To be completely honest? I probably would have been happy to continue to run a 245f/275r stagger. The additional "grip" afforded me up front now probably will require a slight adjustment in my driving to take full advantage, meaning now, in all likelihood, I can probably brake a little less and carry more speed through the first 1/2 of turn-in for more laps, resulting in faster lap times and more consistent lap times.

Understeer is mostly induced by driver and NOT inherent in any of these car's set up. Yes the staggered set up may "promote" understeer, but that understeer is always a direct result of a driver's input. Has nothing to do with the car, at least, not on THIS car.

Now that the dissertation is over...No I do not run the 275mm set-up on the street nor do I intend to. After my track weekend I swap back to my street set of Falken RT-615K on my Alpina Dynamic Replicas, 18"x8.5" et38 with 245/40/R18 tires front on a 5mm spacer, 18"x9.5" et26 with 275/35/R18 rears.

[sipman]

Thanks for the replies and sorry to the OP for some threadjacking. Hope it didn't bore anyone as I find this interesting as all.

[The HACK]

Originally Posted by angel@forgemotorsport.com

Let's just say that I disagree with you. A quick look at the z4's that competed in the etgp last year, some very fast tracked z4's around the country, bmw's own z4gte and my own experience all contradict you. If they run any stagger at all it is very small like 265/275 or 300/310 in the case of the gte.

Interesting thing about that premise. I'll bet those cars you mentioned (I searched ETGP and didn't come up with anything remotely related?) probably have significant aero work. Once you introduce aero, then the tire requirements change, since now you can introduce more load in corners to the tires therefore more heat will be generated and more heat needs to be dissipated. You're not necessarily adding grip by going wider, at least not the way we are conditioned to think, but you're adding more capacity for the tire to handle heat, therefore adding (ultimately) more available grip.

[StickMon]

Eurotuner GP Cup ?