Cult Classic

[epbrown]

Originally Posted by car62

I didn't look up the definitions of the words in the dictionary. Sorry if my grasp of the niceties of the English language is lacking, but I am from Georgia so I do have some excuse.

I don't know if I buy that reasoning, seeing as how I'm from Kentucky myself, but even so I was just clarifying, not correcting you. I was brought up to believe you don't correct other adults on word usage or pronunciation.

The word "classic" is pretty nebulous in most people's minds - usually they picture any nice, old car. Others think it's only something on the green at Pebble Beach. The AACA, the closest we've got to an authority in the US, says it's got to be built before WW2, which most people of a younger vintage don't set with. Given all that, I just wanted to clear up the phrase before continuing the discussion.

Fair warning: don't get me started on defining "rare" as it applies to cars. That word also comes up a lot in discussing the Z4 M Coupe's future.

[onelove]

The Z3M was a cult classic IMo. The Z4M is not so much cult, but much more fun / responsive to drive.

[AWM3]

Originally Posted by onelove

The Z3M was a cult classic IMo. The Z4M is not so much cult, but much more fun / responsive to drive.

I owned a Z3MC before my current Z4MC. It was very responsive and a lot of fun to drive. Admittedly it had a TC Kline suspension, engine mods, better wheels and tires, exhaust, and etc. Getting the rear suspension right with different bushings, springs, and shocks made a huge difference. But in some ways I liked it better than the Z4. The interior was more cohesive with an updated vintage look, round dial instruments with chrome ring surrounds, traditional BMW gauge cluster, etc. It also had outstanding outward visibility with no blind spots, unlike the Z4 which is claustrophobic. I was not a big fan of the "clown shoe" styling, but it was purposeful and practical. I totally enjoyed the Z3MC and have only fond memories of it.

[onelove]

Originally Posted by car62

I owned a Z3MC before my current Z4MC. It was very responsive and a lot of fun to drive. Admittedly it had a TC Kline suspension, engine mods, better wheels and tires, exhaust, and etc. Getting the rear suspension right with different bushings, springs, and shocks made a huge difference. But in some ways I liked it better than the Z4. The interior was more cohesive with an updated vintage look, round dial instruments with chrome ring surrounds, traditional BMW gauge cluster, etc. It also had outstanding outward visibility with no blind spots, unlike the Z4 which is claustrophobic. I was not a big fan of the "clown shoe" styling, but it was purposeful and practical. I totally enjoyed the Z3MC and have only fond memories of it.

I too had a fully equipped Z3M (Stoptechs / TC Kline / Headers / Intake / Exhaust, etc) and now have a similarly equipped Z4M.

The Z3M usually got one of three comments "wow what is that" "wow that's an ugly car" or "wow that's one of my favorite body styles of all time". The Z4M usually gets much more positive comments from everyone, most don't know what it is. It definitely doesn't feel like the same "cult ownership" that my Z3M did, but I think overall it definitely was an improvement in drive ability and comfort in every aspect, as it should be.

for comparisons

[AWM3]

My Z3MC



My Z4MC

[Eccentric]

onelove, your z3mc is stunning!

[Diokaef]

Just add this http://www.bespokeventures.com/blog/...rick-callahan/ maybe a repost but definitely worth it the reading.

[gigtime]

I always thought the Z3 was more likely to become a classic than the Z4 because it had kind of a timeless design. And the Z3 coupe is so unusual I can see it showing up in car magazines (or the digital equivalent) in 20 years. Hard to say with the Z4. I get compliments on mine all the time and few realize it's an 8 year-old car. It doesn't hurt that the e89 doesn't, to the causal observer, look that much different from my `03. I don't see it appreciating in value, though.

[drbvac]

Funny what will make a car desirable in 20 years time is often not appreciated now - it is all supply and demand but a big factor over a quarter century is numbers of cars available.

Some collectible corvettes now were made in the thousands 30 years ago - now they say it is one of 30 left - my Z-4 M coupe, even with a shortened race history, does have the famous straight 6 M motor in a coupe. It is Imola red and based on some research it is one of 35 red 2006 M coupes ever built. The other 1800 in NA are included in the next couple of years but the total number is never going up. As they depreciate they are worth less and less to a lot of owners and the really nice examples become even rarer.

The design is a classic "shooting brake" british design as is the Jaguar XKE, Shelby coupe, 240 z nissan, Early FORD gt - it may be a little odd to some but in a while considering all newer cars are becoming clones - rounded smoothed off gas savers, the different ones will be rare.

[krnnerdboy]

e86m will most definitely follow in the steps of the z3m as will the e85m to the z3m roadster. The z3m roadsters are roughly 25% cheaper than the coupes, but they have appreciated in recent years, but mostly limited to the s54 variants

[Eccentric]

Do you think that the e86 is as unusual as the original M Coupe? I think that has a lot to do with why the Z3MC is appreciating.

[biped]

It will be interesting to see what the immediate future of fuels does to cars/collectors/values.

[ricanbandit]

In 20 years I might be dead (or tomorrow for that matter), but today... I smile my Freaking ASS off every time I get behind the wheel of my Z4M (R)

I hated how the Z4 looked when it came out, but now... I keep looking back at it as I leave it parked.

I drank the koolaid

[Huz-Z]

Originally Posted by ricanbandit

In 20 years I might be dead (or tomorrow for that matter), but today... I smile my Freaking ASS off every time I get behind the wheel of my Z4M (R)

I hated how the Z4 looked when it came out, but now... I keep looking back at it as I leave it parked.

I drank the koolaid

I must be unique; as soon as I saw a Z4, I wanted one. And I do the same thing when I park my car LOL!!!

[ANUSTART]

Z8 yes, Z4 no. Far too accessible and those that have them drive them. Just enjoy a great car and expect normal depreciation.

@ricanbandit, I do the same thing.

[esqu1re]

I don't think it'll ever be as "cult classic" as the z3m (with the S54).

A recent search on cars.com revealed that the most expensive z3mc for sale is a few grand than the most expensive z4mc for sale right now. Might mean something...might not. Time will tell if the price for the Z4mc ever goes up though.

[boondocksaint]

Just some fuel for the fire:

Originally Posted by TopGear.com car reviews

Feels like a modern muscle car; the ride might be a bit firm, but nothing puts a smile on your face like a BMW Z4 Coupe. It’s a modern legend.

*Comfort

Possibly not. The ride is hard, there's not much headroom and you can't see anything that's further than 20ft from the rear windscreen because of the sloping roofline. But who gives a stuff? Sit down, shut up and hold on.
Rated 10 out of 20

*Performance

Two engines: 3.0-litre straight six with 265bhp, 0-62mph in 5.7 seconds and 155mph top end. That's fine and dandy until you drive the last-generation M3-engined Z4M Coupe with a 3.2-litre, 340bhp straight-six that'll get to 62mph in just five and head-butt the limiter at 155mph.
Rated 10 out of 20

*Cool

The Coupe is one of the coolest cars currently in production and don't let anyone tell you otherwise. As was the last one, actually, the now-deceased BMW Coupe.
Rated 15 out of 20

*Quality

Built like it should be; simple and strong. No issues here, though the silver plastic in the cabin can look a bit cheap in some lights.
Rated 14 out of 20

*Handling

Tail happy, hefty steering, no run-flats, no extra gubbins. The Z4 Coupe is pure joy for the driver. It's got huge grip, rides like a racing car and demands your attention all the time. Perfect.
Rated 13 out of 20

*Practicality

It's a hatch, but only small at 240 litres. It's got two seats, but don't apply if you're some sort of 6ft 4in super bean. You can't see out of the back and parking is a complete bugger. But you won't care after five minutes on a country lane.
Rated 6 out of 20

*Running costs

Group 18 or 20 for the pair of variants for insurance, 32-percent tax hit for the 3.0-litre, the full whack for the ‘M' car. Best compromise? The ‘M' car. No, really.

I know they got the goodies in Europe, but truth be told, the car has rarity going for it. Its driving dynamic guarantees a culling of the herd, so to speak. The 944 Turbo S is what it reminds me of in its own way.

Predicting car values - especially modern cars - is like predicting lotto numbers. I'll be interested to see what happens down the road.

[GrayZ4C]

Originally Posted by krnnerdboy

e86m will most definitely follow in the steps of the z3m as will the e85m to the z3m roadster. The z3m roadsters are roughly 25% cheaper than the coupes, but they have appreciated in recent years, but mostly limited to the s54 variants

As a classic car guy I was interested in this thread but I can not find any data that proves that any of the Z3's are in fact appreciating. What I have found is they have not bottomed out on the depreciation curve and seem to have a little more to go. One perfect low mile car that sells for top dollar normally does not "set the market" at the auctions for the rest.

As far as the Z4 cars, only time will tell (lots of time), but I can tell you one thing, save those rims, seats, and anything else the car came with because only the cars that are stock get the big bucks.

[GrayZ4C]

I take it back. The numbers for April show a gain, much more than a summer bump. 3 to 4k across the board- retail, wholesale, and private party

[dazed^]

Originally Posted by hogzilla

Z8 yes, Z4 no. Far too accessible and those that have them drive them. Just enjoy a great car and expect normal depreciation.

Depends on your definition of "normal". Compared to say a 328, our cars hold their value a lot better.

[02fireman]

For what its worth, Hagerty just offered to insure my Mcoupe. And they only insure collectibles ,classics, or rare cars. I just thought of it since they insure my 2002 and they seem to think it's a rare/collectable car. It's more than half off of what I'm paying now so I might do it. For those that DD the cars it won't work though.

[CobraR1339]

Originally Posted by ricanbandit

In 20 years I might be dead (or tomorrow for that matter), but today... I smile my Freaking ASS off every time I get behind the wheel of my Z4M (R)

I hated how the Z4 looked when it came out, but now... I keep looking back at it as I leave it parked.

I drank the koolaid

The Bangled design of the Z4 is timeless IMO. It is the future ..and now the past. The long hood is Jag and like one said 240Z. Will it go up?, I doubt it, Sideways for the M versions likely, but the mileage will be the factor. Low mile examples will be worth more. I predict it will bottom at low 20's and hold or rise from there. Keep your cars in good shape and you should be rewarded.

The only modern BMW to hold it's value is the Z8. The car was/is cool. But not a Super Car in handling or perfromance standards too me. There are others that have dipped and come back from weak values. Been shopping Z8's for a couple years. So rare it's hard to find. It reaminas a sellers market.

The Z M Coupe is better looking than the old couple IMO. But I believe the Roadster has broader appeal, it also means more miles, smiles an with that , more wear and lower values by about 20% 10-20 years from now. Just enjoy it. The big hit is over. The new Z 2009 is not the Drivers car the Z4M is. The Z9 M is the better more acceptable car , but it is a cruiser. The Z4M is that last Raw BMM IMO. The Raw , simple cars always win in value