ZPOST
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   ZPOST > BMW Z4 Technical Talk > Track / Autocross / Dragstrip / Driving Techniques
  TireRack

SUPPORT ZPOST BY DOING YOUR TIRERACK SHOPPING FROM THIS BANNER, THANKS!
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      02-12-2011, 02:00 AM   #45
VMZ432
Fast Everything
1
Rep
93
Posts

 
Drives: Z4MC
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Australia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by O-cha View Post
I just can't believe this.
Then I shall call you Scully.

I did have fade, made that clear. Perhaps what you are trying to say is you can't believe the fade didn't get so crazy bad that unless you were high you'd have no choice but to come in before total failure happened. I assume that is the way it happens most of the time right? Just... not every time.

I'm sure if the parts were anaylsed you'd get all your answers. Doubt that will happen though. But is it so hard to believe a destructing brake pad can cause truly massive heat soak in a short period of time? Nothing in that I find hard to believe.
__________________
2006 IBlue BMW Z4 MC - ESS VT2-525 Supercharged, JRZ RS1 suspension (500#F, 600#R) with Vorshlag plates, ST Trophy BBK with CL R6E pads, KKS gated exhaust, TMS sway bars, RE rear camber arms, VT engine mounts, Recaro Pole Position (driver), APR GT wing, Street: Volk G2s and Potenza, Track: Volk TE37SLs and BFG R1s.
Appreciate 0
      02-16-2011, 03:34 PM   #46
Ringer
Lieutenant
Ringer's Avatar
9
Rep
427
Posts

 
Drives: 2012 BMW 1M Valencia Orange
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: D

iTrader: (0)

Nice saving my friend... And nice brake kit. ;-)
Appreciate 0
      12-09-2012, 05:02 PM   #47
3002 tii
Major General
3002 tii's Avatar
United_States
140
Rep
8,593
Posts

 
Drives: flat out
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NNJ

iTrader: (50)

Garage List
Can't believe I missed this thread. Ordering all the components for a proper brake cooling kit and was researching old threads to find any relevant info. Luckily I've only dealt with fade issues 2x and each time it was the towards the last session of each day. Hopefully the brake ducting will help although my new concern is that it may lead to the rotors cracking prematurely.
__________________

Recaro | Volk | AST | Vorshlag | Quaife | Stoptech | Active Autowerke | BMW Performance

Click here for my track videos
Appreciate 0
      12-09-2012, 05:34 PM   #48
Finnegan
Major General
Finnegan's Avatar
United_States
80
Rep
6,506
Posts

 
Drives: Sapphire Black/Black Z4Mc
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: At the track..or wishing I were at the track

iTrader: (18)

Quote:
Originally Posted by DSC_OFF View Post
Can't believe I missed this thread. Ordering all the components for a proper brake cooling kit and was researching old threads to find any relevant info. Luckily I've only dealt with fade issues 2x and each time it was the towards the last session of each day. Hopefully the brake ducting will help although my new concern is that it may lead to the rotors cracking prematurely.
Post up a thread when you get the kit and install done. I know you have a different bumper, but it would be useful to see how this is configured. (I saw a thread on the UK Z4 forum, but I wasn't convinced about the set-up given how the ducting was routed.)
Appreciate 0
      12-09-2012, 05:35 PM   #49
Kgolf31
Brigadier General
Kgolf31's Avatar
39
Rep
3,353
Posts

 
Drives: 2007 Z4MC, 2012 128i
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Ohio

iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finnegan View Post
Post up a thread when you get the kit and install done. I know you have a different bumper, but it would be useful to see how this is configured. (I saw a thread on the UK Z4 forum, but I wasn't convinced about the set-up given how the ducting was routed.)
+1 it would be helpful information.
__________________
12 128i Coupe - Project STX: TCKline l Active Autowerke l APEX l Vorshlag l Dunlop l Hawk l BMW Performance

Appreciate 0
      12-09-2012, 05:37 PM   #50
3002 tii
Major General
3002 tii's Avatar
United_States
140
Rep
8,593
Posts

 
Drives: flat out
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NNJ

iTrader: (50)

Garage List
Will do, if hoses arrive by Friday and temps stay above 40 this Sat I'll be tackling the project then.
__________________

Recaro | Volk | AST | Vorshlag | Quaife | Stoptech | Active Autowerke | BMW Performance

Click here for my track videos
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2012, 06:06 AM   #51
l4zy
Captain
l4zy's Avatar
United_States
9
Rep
869
Posts

 
Drives: 95 M3, 13 X3
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: San Gabriel, CA

iTrader: (11)

Garage List
wow thanks for bumping the thread. i missed this one too...
__________________
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2012, 04:33 PM   #52
exdos
Second Lieutenant
England
2
Rep
221
Posts

 
Drives: Z3 M Coupe(S54) and Z4 M Coupe
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finnegan View Post
(I saw a thread on the UK Z4 forum, but I wasn't convinced about the set-up given how the ducting was routed.)
That would probably be my posting of a "how to". What do you think is wrong with the set-up?
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2012, 05:55 PM   #53
Finnegan
Major General
Finnegan's Avatar
United_States
80
Rep
6,506
Posts

 
Drives: Sapphire Black/Black Z4Mc
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: At the track..or wishing I were at the track

iTrader: (18)

Quote:
Originally Posted by exdos View Post
That would probably be my posting of a "how to". What do you think is wrong with the set-up?
Nothing wrong, it made sense, and seemed workable. I noticed it after the first few posts and haven't been back to take a second look .

What I don't think was posted was some type of measure of airflow to the rotors and effectiveness. Maybe that's something I just need to look a more updated version of the thread to find?

Work in this area is appreciated!
Appreciate 0
      12-10-2012, 08:54 PM   #54
Punko
Second Lieutenant
2
Rep
248
Posts

 
Drives: 07 Z4 M Coupe
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Hamilton, ON

iTrader: (2)

Holy crap.

I think I would have had to get of the car and clean the seat.
Appreciate 0
      12-11-2012, 10:33 AM   #55
TexasZed4MC
Lieutenant
TexasZed4MC's Avatar
United_States
11
Rep
492
Posts

 
Drives: 2006 Interlagos Z4 M Coupe
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Texas

iTrader: (1)

WOW! This has me very worried about the stock brakes on the car now. As bad as I hate to, I guess I need to start looking for a BBK on the fronts before the April HPDE and June in Austin. The thought of this happening in Austin on the back straight at COTA into turn 12 is not a good thought.
__________________

Lone Star Chapter BMWCCA HPDE Event Chair, Texas Trifecta Event Chair, & BMWCCA driving Instructor
"Racing is important to men who do it well, Racing is.... life, anything that happens before or after is just waiting." - Steve McQueen (Le Mans)

Last edited by TexasZed4MC; 12-11-2012 at 03:44 PM.
Appreciate 0
      12-11-2012, 12:07 PM   #56
aestheticstorm
Captain
aestheticstorm's Avatar
United_States
12
Rep
653
Posts

 
Drives: '08 Z4 M Coupé ...... '09 X5 d
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Miami, FL

iTrader: (2)

VMZ God was on your side for sure. So many things could have gone terribly wrong in that scenario.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The HACK View Post
Beginners almost NEVER overheat their brakes.
Intermediate guys almost always will experience overheating brakes at least once.
Advance intermediate guys rarely overheat their brakes.
Advance guys can and will overheat their brakes at will.
As a beginner/intermediate, I can relate to this. My first track day at Thunderhill, I experienced very little brake fade (stock + pads + fluid + SS). On my second track day at Laguna Seca, my brakes were toast -- pedal to the floor. After reading this thread, it was wise not to go out for the 5th/final session. The Subaru WRX guy in my group parked next to me was actually leaking fluid.

So from this thread and my experience, yes, I think the stock brakes on our Z4Ms are sub-par for track enthusiasts. Sure you can get by with proper braking technique, but the speed ceiling on stock brakes is too low for most folks. I'll for sure be getting a BBK before hitting the track again.
__________________
'08 Z4 ///M Coupé (#1765/1815) — 1 of 68 Sepang Bronze / Black Nappa / Madeira Wood / 1 of 1 this combo
19" Advan RS / AP Racing / Bridgestone RE-11 / Autosolutions / R.E. Diablo / R.E. trans mounts
'09 X5 35dSpace Grey / Saddle Brown
20" Forgestar F14

Last edited by aestheticstorm; 12-11-2012 at 12:12 PM.
Appreciate 0
      12-11-2012, 12:40 PM   #57
Kgolf31
Brigadier General
Kgolf31's Avatar
39
Rep
3,353
Posts

 
Drives: 2007 Z4MC, 2012 128i
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Ohio

iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasZed4MC View Post
WOW! This has me very worried about the stock brakes on the car now. As bad as I hate to I guess I need to star looking for a BBK on the fronts before the April HPDE and June in Austin. The thought of this happening in Austin on the back straight at COTA into turn 12 is not a good thought.
You'll be fine with proper fluid and pads.

Mid-Ohio is around 3000 feet long on their straight, going downhill.

COTA is around 3200-3500 feet long.

I ran HP+ pads and even though they aren't even track pads I was fine.
__________________
12 128i Coupe - Project STX: TCKline l Active Autowerke l APEX l Vorshlag l Dunlop l Hawk l BMW Performance

Appreciate 0
      12-12-2012, 04:05 AM   #58
exdos
Second Lieutenant
England
2
Rep
221
Posts

 
Drives: Z3 M Coupe(S54) and Z4 M Coupe
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finnegan View Post
Nothing wrong, it made sense, and seemed workable. I noticed it after the first few posts and haven't been back to take a second look .

What I don't think was posted was some type of measure of airflow to the rotors and effectiveness. Maybe that's something I just need to look a more updated version of the thread to find?

Work in this area is appreciated!
Thanks!

I will doff my cap to anyone who can come up with a better way of routing ducting from a zone of high pressure/cold air at the front of the Z4M to the brakes. Obviously, I could have made fancier fittings but what I have made works well and was made out of bits and pieces that I had to hand.

With regards to the flow rate, I wrote in the thread: " If you use the calculator here: http://www.1728.org/flowrate.htm you can estimate the flow rate of air at different speeds of the vehicle. If we assume the diameter of the brake ducting is 1.75" (being conservative) then at 50mph over 34 litres/sec of air passes into the centres of the brakes and at 80mph it is 55.47 litres/per second, all that air MUST have more cooling effect on the brakes than with no ducting. "

When all is said and done, it's the constant flow of air through the ducting that is the effective part of this mod, and this is not diminished because there aren't any expensive fancy Carbon Fibre parts at both ends of that ducting


Here are a couple of links to my brake "How Tos":
http://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewto...p?f=34&t=38775
http://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewto...p?f=34&t=45293

Last edited by exdos; 12-12-2012 at 04:11 AM.
Appreciate 0
      12-12-2012, 07:09 PM   #59
VMZ432
Fast Everything
1
Rep
93
Posts

 
Drives: Z4MC
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Australia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by exdos View Post
Thanks for that! I would very much like to try this. Here is a post from ages back I had bookmarked where something similar was done. Your descriptions are much more detailed though.

http://www.zpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=410641
__________________
2006 IBlue BMW Z4 MC - ESS VT2-525 Supercharged, JRZ RS1 suspension (500#F, 600#R) with Vorshlag plates, ST Trophy BBK with CL R6E pads, KKS gated exhaust, TMS sway bars, RE rear camber arms, VT engine mounts, Recaro Pole Position (driver), APR GT wing, Street: Volk G2s and Potenza, Track: Volk TE37SLs and BFG R1s.
Appreciate 0
      01-21-2013, 10:09 AM   #60
3002 tii
Major General
3002 tii's Avatar
United_States
140
Rep
8,593
Posts

 
Drives: flat out
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NNJ

iTrader: (50)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finnegan View Post
Post up a thread when you get the kit and install done. I know you have a different bumper, but it would be useful to see how this is configured. (I saw a thread on the UK Z4 forum, but I wasn't convinced about the set-up given how the ducting was routed.)
finally

http://www.zpost.com/forums/showthread.php?p=13344899
__________________

Recaro | Volk | AST | Vorshlag | Quaife | Stoptech | Active Autowerke | BMW Performance

Click here for my track videos
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:29 AM.




zpost
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST