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      08-21-2012, 08:52 PM   #1
GammaZeta
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Euro Header Questions

I read a lot about using Euro headers for our Z4M's, but not being mechanically inclined, I couldn't find the answers to some basic questions. I read a lot about O2 sensors, bungs, etc., but it was all greek to me.

Maybe some people could explain and suggest a few things to me?

Is it any year euro headers from a european E46 M3? Is there specific part numbers? Anything I should look for in purchasing a set?

How much would I be looking at to pay for a used set in decent condition?

Will my car still be able to pass emissions?

If I had my mechanic install them, how much would the job probably cost? Would there be a lot of fabrication, twisting and changing things? Or would the install be pretty straight forward?

Thanks!
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      08-22-2012, 09:49 AM   #2
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Any European market header off of an E46 M3 or Z4M Coupe/Roadster. With that in mind, there is also the CSL header. The CSL header is the same as the standard European market header with the exception that each header is about 2lbs lighter and there is not flat spot on cylinder runner number 6. Headers or a LHD or RHD car will fit with issue.

If you replace the headers on the Z4M with the European market headers you will be eliminating the primary catalytic converters. You will still have the secondary catalytic converters, are they enough to clean the exhaust, I don't know. Once you replace your headers with the European market headers, then secondary (post cat) O2 sensors and EGT sensor no longer have a home. Many people choose to add bungs to their secondary cats, this in essence replicates the European market E46 M3/E85 & E86 Z4M setup. Although the secondary USA market cats are less restrictive than the European market primary. headers.

I paid about $568 for my headers shipped. My custom catalytic converter section is going to run about $1300-1400.
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      08-22-2012, 10:08 AM   #3
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So basically they probably won't be able to pass emissions? Or would have a strong possibility of not passing?

So the headers would cost between $500 - $1,000, then the custom cat converter will be another $1,500 to pass emissions? Then the cost of install?
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      08-22-2012, 10:37 AM   #4
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You will likely fail emissions.

You don't need to go the custom cat route, would probably run about $300 to modify your stock secondary cats.
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      08-22-2012, 11:26 AM   #5
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Regarding CA Emissions, the word is that many with the Euro and EGR/O2 relocation can and do pass tailpipe smog tests. That info is based on a shop here in Norcal.

Note that the cats in the headers are for cold start emissions (closer to the engine, heat up quickly). Europe isn't a cat free zone, and they do care about emissions, so running the "secondary" cats may indeed be sufficient. The "secondary" cats are, as far as folks have been able to tell, the same cell count and size as the Euro, and are the "primary" and sole set of cats in Europe.

Regardless, in CA, the tailpipe test is to be replaced in 2013 by an ODBII readiness check, so the rules have changed. Things changed with AB229, section 44012.

This may mean that as long as it looks stock (Euro headers, not coated), it may very well pass the visual check assuming they don't go looking at the secondary cats that closely and notice the EGR and O2 relocation. As long as there's no CEL or other emissions related codes stored in the ECU, and if I'm reading AB229 (and CARB's interpretation) correctly that should be enough to pass emissions.

Of course, it may help to know a shop that isn't going to get out the magnifying glass and start looking for things and will rather focus on "plugging in the computer and checking for codes" rather than searching for those relocation markers.
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      08-22-2012, 12:12 PM   #6
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That's funny, I actually failed my last inspection because my ODBII failed the readiness check when I disconnected the battery. I had it inspected right after and there wasn't enough information for the ODBII.

Does that mean in Massachusetts i should be all set?

So if I was just to do the headers, straight up install, there may be a chance I would pass emissions?
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      08-22-2012, 01:21 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GammaZeta View Post
So if I was just to do the headers, straight up install, there may be a chance I would pass emissions?

Not a chance, you will throw a code, and you will fail anywhere if you have a code. Even the extremely lenient state of LA won't pass you if your light is on.


You have to relocate EGT and O2 and cross your fingers it doewsn't throw a code. I lucked out.
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      08-22-2012, 01:34 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Geauxkart View Post
Not a chance, you will throw a code, and you will fail anywhere if you have a code. Even the extremely lenient state of LA won't pass you if your light is on.


You have to relocate EGT and O2 and cross your fingers it doewsn't throw a code. I lucked out.
Ok, so my ignorance is showing again. Please bare with me.

1. So if I puchase the euro heads, my mechanic should be able to "easily" relocate the EGT and O2 sensors?

2. I understood that I could get a tune, and part of that tune would delete or block the code?

3. My state (Mass.) does the OBD testing and then does the tubes on the exhaust. Assuming I have my mechanic relocate the things he needs to, and I get a tune, I would be all set?
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      08-22-2012, 02:05 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GammaZeta View Post
Ok, so my ignorance is showing again. Please bare with me.

1. So if I puchase the euro heads, my mechanic should be able to "easily" relocate the EGT and O2 sensors?

2. I understood that I could get a tune, and part of that tune would delete or block the code?

3. My state (Mass.) does the OBD testing and then does the tubes on the exhaust. Assuming I have my mechanic relocate the things he needs to, and I get a tune, I would be all set?
I suggest have a complete Euro header and section 1 setup. This is a plug-and-play configuration. Your mechanic can do all the work without modifying US section 1. This is the route I went. The car have no code since the mod without a tune.
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      08-22-2012, 02:07 PM   #10
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Oh ok, so in addition to just the euro headers, I would also need the euro section 1?

Section 1 being the euro cats?
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      08-22-2012, 02:12 PM   #11
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It's not hard to relocate the EGT and O2 sensors, but does require some welding and finding the right bungs to weld into the Section 1. Don't know the price on the euro section 1, but I bet it ain't cheap, and probably not too many around for sale either.


I have a nice welder, and am good at it, but it's a bit far to tell you to stop by....
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      08-22-2012, 02:20 PM   #12
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I like the idea of a modest power gain and better noise, but now it seems like it might cost some real money to do this.

Maybe I should just go back to my exhaust idea...
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      08-22-2012, 02:37 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GammaZeta View Post
I like the idea of a modest power gain and better noise, but now it seems like it might cost some real money to do this.

Maybe I should just go back to my exhaust idea...
It's a pretty major/hardcore mod IMO.

We never asked why you wanted to do this. So, why? Sound mainly? If so, this mod isn't the way I'd go. It's really less about sound, and more about power (and to some degree heat reduction if you track).

If you're after sound enhancement, the easier route is either an axle-back or axle-back + RE X-Pipe. (I say RE, because the Supersprint doesn't seem to yield much sound enhancement.) Another route would be the Gruppe M intake.

Plenty of threads and discussion on axle-backs and X-pipes, drone, loudness, tone, etc. around here. Here is a recent exhaust thread, here's the Exhaust Fest Comparison Thread (tons more on exhaust if you search) and here's one on install (axle back is an easy install, x-pipe a bit more involved).
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      08-22-2012, 03:37 PM   #14
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Yeah, it seems to be a pretty hardcore mod!!!!!!!!

Sound and performance. I figured if I was going to drop $1,500 for an exhaust, maybe I could get the headers for sound AND performance for around the same price.

Just testing the waters, but this seems more involved than I would like.
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      08-22-2012, 04:25 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GammaZeta View Post
Yeah, it seems to be a pretty hardcore mod!!!!!!!!

Sound and performance. I figured if I was going to drop $1,500 for an exhaust, maybe I could get the headers for sound AND performance for around the same price.

Just testing the waters, but this seems more involved than I would like.
If you're not totally drone adverse, a set of Aeroturbine resonators, some tips, and a custom build by a good muffler shop should set you back around 500 bucks. Always an option.

Otherwise if you want a reasonably priced exhaust, consider what you value most (tone, loud, etc.), what you don't want (e.g. drone, rasp), and look for a nice used set. I just sold my Diablos for a very reasonable price, about half of what you were thinking about. Other items, such as Remus, RPI, Stromung, etc. come up for sale now and then. Again, usually at around half to a little bit more than half of what you were planning to spend.
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      08-22-2012, 08:13 PM   #16
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It's a nice car. If you could afford to buy it, you should be able to justify the cost to mod it right. Also, BMW did good stuff on this car, tips and resonators may get the sound "right", but ain't gonna produce the power associated with the sound... don't rice it. Save your pennies and do it correctly.
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      08-22-2012, 08:19 PM   #17
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It's not that I can't afford to mod headers, it's just too much trouble right now.

I already have on my list some minor body work to get it 100%, refurbishing the wheels and the adding aero sides. Then a tune in the spring.

Maybe an exhaust for right now will suffice.
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      08-22-2012, 10:06 PM   #18
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Try to contacct donovan who is a ZPost member. I think he can get Euro section 1. I didn't buy it from him. My set came from UK which is most likely where it is available.

Check out this classify.
http://www.zpost.com/forums/showthre...section&page=2
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      08-23-2012, 01:30 PM   #19
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Does the Euro section 1 have to be Z4M specific or will an E46M work as well? I can probably get my cousin to ship me one...
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      08-23-2012, 01:55 PM   #20
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E46 looks similar but is different.
You need the Z4M specific one.
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      08-23-2012, 02:45 PM   #21
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E46 looks similar but is different.
You need the Z4M specific one.
Thanks man.
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